change opinions

[katya]

I was look one very interesting TV, about life Russian women at another countries. I was change some my opinions.
Early I was sure, that girl aren

[Kenneth]

Katya,
I don't know about France, but I believe in US, the man may need to prove that he is not married for Fiance Visa. I am not positive on that, just what I thought I read somewhere.

[liam]

hi katya, i'm not really 100% sure what your talking about but over here if you get married you get a 'marriage certificate', if you marry again without getting divorce you go straight to jail. Simple.

If your talking about where you'll get married, i'm not so sure..........eg if you came here (nz), you would'nt need to be married too me, but i would need cash or assets of 7000nzd (approx 3000$usd..its getting better, the exchange rate, cos the american economy is going down big time), then you get a 3 month visa............if you do a runner, need anything at all, i have to pay or you get deported.
During this 3 month period, you decide if you want to marry..........if you do, get married, take the papers to immigration department, pay 200$ and you have residency for ever, then you can leave me after 2 days and marry a millionaire. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif . Nz is'nt so paranoid as the us or england about immigration (after all they let me in.......and as vicky knows i'm a 100% hooligan).

But i guess that for a girl, here wedding day is extra special...she'd want her family and friends, big party etc etc etc so i'd prefer too be married in russia..........its easy for some friends of mine and my parents to go to russia for the ceremony and would probably be more of a laugh than our usual family gatherings. If i loved her enough to marry her...............she could choose and i'd be happy either way.

As for children, unless the girl is a proven , drug addict, prostitute, psycho etc etc , she would always be given the child too look after if they divorced, she could return to russia, or she could stay in nz, if she wanted (nothing too do with her ex-husband), get a job or go on the DPB (domestic purpose benefit for single moms), get a cool house by the beach, and 300$ a week courtesy of the nz tax payers. If she decided to go back to russia the man would have money taken from his pay each week by the government, and it would be sent to russia each week for her and her child. (my friend has this 'arrangement with his ex wife from hungary).

mind you re-reading that it sounds like finding a nz man would be quite a smart idea for a scammer. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif ................it won't come my way though cos i'm not that silly. cheers, liam

[katya]

There was history of one girl

[MartinUK]

Katya,
In UK (England) I cannot prove I am not married. If I were married, divorced, separated, widowed then I would have paperwork to prove it but nobody gives you a piece of paper to say you have remained single.
Perhaps a golden rule should be not to make babies until after marriage. In European Union countries a man (or woman) cannot marry if they are already married, if they do then they go to prison ..... and I guess would not then be in a position to look after a child thus perhaps the child would go to the other parent.
If there is a subsequent divorce then I guess a court should decide the best destiny of any child, I do not believe one should pre-judge that a child should always go with the mother or the father, every circumstance is different and should be judged individually.

[Kenneth]

Katya,
I understand what you mean about having a contract so that a Russian woman can return to Russia with her child. I don't condone what the man has done and how he has deceived the woman, however, what about the man's parental rights to his child? Don't you think he is entitled to seeing his child on a regular basis, regardless of how inconsiderate he may have been. I don't think the child should suffer without a father even though he may not be the best example. What are your thoughts?

[777]

(Katya @ April 22 2003,12:29)

Hi Katya,

would be interesting to know if the French man was of French or of North African or Black African origin (from former colonies).
Polygamy is nothing unusual in Africa, but of course couldn't be realised officially in Europe. So possibly this man told about queer marriage stuff to get a second woman and another child ...

In Germany Turkish people account for the biggest part of the non-German population (men came here for work in the 60ies and early 70ies, their families followed) and in talkshows not seldom you hear German girls married to turkish guys telling that they found out that "her husband" was already married in Turkey (children there are promised one another for marriage and have to marrry later as to the will of their parents).

Another attitude especially from black American soldiers, who were deployed some time here, was to make little babies to their German girlfriends and then go back to USA without caring about their offsprings anymore ... (the white race under attack ?? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

Even a friend from studying days seems to belong to this species. The Congolese joined my then (1980) West-German university after having studied some semesters at Minsk university and already having making pregnant two east-German girls studying also in Belarus. He then made some kind of baby break http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif, almost 20 years later he recognised me at a trade fair, meanwhile child Nr. 3 from an (divorced) marriage with a Congolese woman was some years old, and he had a moscowian girlfriend.
The last time I telephoned with him was half a year ago, today I tried again, but he had his phone disconnected and the directory enquiries don't find his name in whole Germany ...
He has a very nice character (he cares about his women and his children http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif) but also seems to be a bearer of this "make many children to many women" - gene. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Tom]

Another attitude especially from black American soldiers, who were deployed some time here, was to make little babies to their German girlfriends and then go back to USA without caring about their offsprings anymore ... (the white race under attack ?? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

Even a friend from studying days seems to belong to this species. The Congolese joined my then (1980) West-German university after having studied some semesters at Minsk university and already having making pregnant two east-German girls studying also in Belarus. He then made some kind of baby break http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif, almost 20 years later he recognised me at a trade fair, meanwhile child Nr. 3 from an (divorced) marriage with a Congolese woman was some years old, and he had a moscowian girlfriend.
The last time I telephoned with him was half a year ago, today I tried again, but he had his phone disconnected and the directory enquiries don't find his name in whole Germany ...
He has a very nice character (he cares about his women and his children http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif) but also seems to be a bearer of this "make many children to many women" - gene. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
If I were wise, I would not touch this topic with a ten foot pole! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

But here goes...First, I live and work in a county where blacks outnumber whites...so I am the minority. But I have learned a bit since I have lived hear. And what I have learned is not inconsistant with my previous theories. What I am about to say is self-evident. I do not think I am breaking any new ground by saying this. But there is no 'gene' that makes blacks behave in a certain way. But here in the US, there is a large 'culture gap' between blacks and whites. It would be racist to say the 'white culture' is superior to 'black culture'. But I can say that many things in their culture run quite contrary to my upbringing. It is this culture gap that results in the 'race problem' that we have in the US. For example, I have mentioned that I know a Russian girl who lives here in the US. In terms of culture and basic values, I have more in common with Sveta, who has been in this country for 3 years, than I do with most African Americans who have been in the US all their lives.

Tom

[liam]

Theres a similair situation here..........with maori/pacific islanders and to a certain extent i agree with what tom says. But the really alarming concern is that the vast majority of the youth totally and utterly embrace u.s inspired 'black culture'...walk down any main street, in any town in nz and all you can see are maori/pacific islanders living some freaky paraody of u.s gangsta rappers....the clothes,the hand signals, tagging, gang culture, drug ideals etc etc etc. and its all copied straight out of american mass media.

Nz is now so overtly politically correct that there's positive discrimination of whites........i recently went for a job interview as a social worker and was told that i would'nt fit in to the 'maori' culture of the office............, at universities white students need higher grades to pass than maori etc etc etc.and whites are 88% of the population!!!!!!!!!!!!..........its kinda all kept hidden though...you'd never notice it all in regular life but when you stop and consider................ http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif liam

[sean]

(Katya @ April 22 2003,12:29)


In Germany Turkish people account for the biggest part of the non-German population (men came here for work in the 60ies and early 70ies, their families followed) and in talkshows not seldom you hear German girls married to turkish guys telling that they found out that "her husband" was already married in Turkey (children there are promised one another for marriage and have to marrry later as to the will of their parents).
777, I think that you must be a very high educated and intelligent gentleman. The more I am surprised that

1.) you waste your time watching this crap talk shows made for idiots

2.) you belive this stuff...

hmmm... As far as family values, the majority that you were talking about, could learn a lot from this Turkish people. Besides polygamy is prohibited by law in Turkey. The Islam has a very clear definition of who is allowed to have more than one woman. Only these men are allowed that are able to financially support them. Since the time of Atatuerk polygamy and Islam legislation does not exist any more in Turkey. But I know a hole bunch of German guys that have more then three women. Not on paper, but as you say in Germany, paper is very patient.

If I would be you, I would carefully think about whether to start a serious relationship with a foreign woman or not. Obviously you have a problem with cultures different to yours. But your culture is thank god not the common German . So I would like to know what you do once you find out that the eastern lady of your heart loves more your

[liam]

g'day 7, please enlighten me on the reason why "black american soldiers", "congolese" and "turkish people" are in germany in the first place http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif ........................and was it only black american soldiers that convinced your lovely fair-haired german maidens to 'put-out'...........those lovely clean-cut white americans marines would never, ever in there wildest dreams want to get laid while on service overseas would they? liam

[katya]

I am agree with you, that children mustn

[katya]

Kennet,
If mother want to back at Russia, but father want to stay at his country

[katya]

777,

[katya]

Liam , here is more worse.
Here, if you live at Russia all your life you will feel yourself worse, then you was come only yesterday . in my town there is a lot of * refugee* - if true , they are simply people from another countries.
If you are from another country , you can buy flat cheaper, they will help you with work , at go to university is too more simpler.
Sometimes so pity.
They come, take everything, sell it , and go at another place. As locusts.
As with every year at my town more and more such people.

[katya]

Sean

[MartinUK]

Katya,
I believe that under normal circumstances a child's best place is with the mother but I do insist that each case should be judged individually.
With regards to 'unplanned' children before marriage,, yes, accidents do happen but I guess that only a very small percentage of unplanned children are due to 'accidents'.
I would moreso suggest that the majority of unplanned children are due to carelessness on the part of the parents thus your original post refers to only a very small percentage, the rest relies upon more responsible partners.

[liam]

g'day katya.........you mention about bad mothers and wonder if there are many?.........well i do lot of work as a 'minder' for a government department that provides protection/security for abused children, social workers, youth workers in grim parts of the country etc etc etc........and i could tell you many many many horror stories about exactly what some of these 'mothers' have done to there children and families.

So you want me to come too your town as a refugee??..........i don't think with a british/nz passport they'll beleive that i'm escaping from oppression or abject poverty................. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif , mind you the Green Party is a national embarresment here, of epic proportions............(f@*king hippies as our members of parliament who boast about smoking weed while at work etc etc), so maybe i could come as a political refugee!!!!!!!!!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif liam.

[Olgakazakevich]

but I guess that only a very small percentage of unplanned children are due to 'accidents'.Yes, may be I will agree with Martin, although it is not easy for me as a woman. I have heared a lot of stories how women are catching men such way

[Kenneth]

Katya,
I believe that every situation may be different as to whether or not the child should know about their biological father and when. Speaking from some experience and being on both sides, first as a child who came from a home where my parents were divorced while I was very young; and second as a parent who raised a child that was essentially abandoned from his natural father. I feel it is best to tell the truth about a childs father (or mother) to the child, when the child is at an appropriate age to understand. There could be extenuating circumstances where it would not be a good idea to do so such as the father being a mass murderer or something along those lines. In that case the truth may do more harm to the child than good. However, this may not prevent the truth from eventually coming out. Although I had no desire for many many years to find out anything

[MartinUK]

Olga,
If an unplanned pregnancy and child are the woman's way of 'catching' her man then perhaps she may deserve the heartache of any custody battles thereafter.

[katya]

Olga..
Or man caught woman .
So , I am not think , that it is very little percentage.

[katya]

MartinUK , don

[MartinUK]

Katya,
I agree with everything you say, I just cannot agree that a lady 'should' catch her man by becoming pregnant.
Bringing children into this world is the biggest of decisions that 2 people should decide together and not by 1 whose paramount intention is to entrap the other.

[777]

(Katya @ April 22 2003,12:29)


In Germany Turkish people account for the biggest part of the non-German population (men came here for work in the 60ies and early 70ies, their families followed) and in talkshows not seldom you hear German girls married to turkish guys telling that they found out that "her husband" was already married in Turkey (children there are promised one another for marriage and have to marrry later as to the will of their parents).
777, I think that you must be a very high educated and intelligent gentleman. The more I am surprised that

1.) you waste your time watching this crap talk shows made for idiots

2.) you belive this stuff...


I'm looking or much more hearing at them while working - as a variation to radio news. You're right, time shouldn't be wasted, but using TV as entertainment if you're working not so intellectually - I like it often.

Of course there's a wide quality range as to talkshows as to every kind of broadcast, also changes by time ...

If you cannnot believe this, what else can you believe? Is there something more authentic on TV?

[Rascal]

You can't trust the French anyhow, they showed thier ass during the Iraq war, and dont trust the Germans, You can trust the English they might talk like a bunch of sissies but at least they will help in a fight.

[MartinUK]

Rascal,
As they say in Netherlands .... 'Oprotten'.
With a wife, a tart on the side and no interest in FSU ladies you have no right to be on such a site as this and furthermore you bring disrepute upon your fellow countrymen bringing racist remarks onto such a site.
I am not a racist but if we were to lower myself to your level I would point out that at least the Brits can point their weapons in the right direction and not fire upon killing their allies.
If you want to start shouting your mouth off then I suggest you engage your brain first however I guess there is little hope of that.

[liam]

g'day,

the military of any country are only a political tool.war is only ever fought for political reasons. politician's order there armies to fight. France did'nt involve itself in the war in iraq for (rightly or wrongly) political reasons, thats all, there soldiers are indeed way way tough but there masters did'nt choose to use them. Simple. Go to france, start a fight and see for yourself.

I agree though..you can't trust the germans http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[liam]

Mind you during the build up to the recent war in iraq the biggest mass-selling newspaper in england, The Sun, printed a cover on its newspaper (and sent 50.000 free copies to france), with a simple but kinda true message. There was a huge picture of british and american soldiers landing on french beaches on D-Day..............across the top were the words "Monstrous Ingratitude"...sums it up perfectly. liam

[MartinUK]

Liam,
I take no pride with regard to my response to the jerk Rascal but please, can we keep politics off this site whether it be Brits, French, Germans, Americans etc. I'm sure there are plenty of websites where one can voice their political views, this is not one of them.
No offence intended, I hope you understand.

[liam]

sorry martin i don't understand...........you answer a comment from rascal by using overtly racist/political rhetoric, "at least the brits can point there weopens........" then i follow suit..............and you tell me to try and keep politics off this site!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

heed your own advice before you offer it too others http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif liam.

[sean]

Liam,
I take no pride with regard to my response to the jerk Rascal but please, can we keep politics off this site whether it be Brits, French, Germans, Americans etc. I'm sure there are plenty of websites where one can voice their political views, this is not one of them.
No offence intended, I hope you understand.
Martin, thank you very much for your wise words !!!

You showed what a real English gentleman is.

I wish there would be more people like you !

[Vicky]

To make it lighter - a nice joke i've read today

A talk at the Australian airport customs between an Englishman and an officer.
O: Do you have any convictions?
E: They are still required to permit entering the country?

[Tom]

Liam,
I take no pride with regard to my response to the jerk Rascal but please, can we keep politics off this site whether it be Brits, French, Germans, Americans etc. I'm sure there are plenty of websites where one can voice their political views, this is not one of them.
No offence intended, I hope you understand.
Martin, thank you very much for your wise words !!!

You showed what a real English gentleman is.

I wish there would be more people like you !
I have to respectfully disagree.
Martin.. after having taken the bait of a common troll (and sinking to his level with your own response), please do not propose to regulate OUR speech.
That said, politics should probably be confined to the 'Free Talks' area. That is, after all, what it is there for.

" Free Talks
Post anything about anything in here.
Commercial posts are not allowed!"

I'm sure this is a reasonable compromise. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Tom

[liam]

g'day whats all this?...pick on liam day. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[sean]

Tom, I do not think that anybody wants to regulate your speech. We are always interested in your opinion. You are also right that this is a free talk. But one thing about this site that I liked was the level and respect that everybody used in this place since the day that Mr. Rascal started to bring agitation in the group. Now we have two options: Either we find back to our former polite way to treat each other and learn from our experiences or we start a new primitive relation, following may be what the intention of above mentioned gentleman was. I would prefer the first option !

And knowing you as a well educated and kind gentleman, I am convinced that youre also interested in a harmonious and friendy atmosphere here. I also did the mistake to judge too much about certain things but seeing to which point this is leading, I have learned for the future.

[sean]

To make it lighter - a nice joke i've read today

A talk at the Australian airport customs between an Englishman and an officer.
O: Do you have any convictions?
E: They are still required to permit entering the country?
Vladimir Putin arrives on an official visit to Spain in Madrid. He is received by Aznar and both first go for a sightseeing tour through Madrid. Putin is shown the Escorial and all the sites of interest there. Finally they go to Aznar

[Kenneth]

Sean & Vicky,
That was great! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[katya]

Katya,
I agree with everything you say, I just cannot agree that a lady 'should' catch her man by becoming pregnant.
Bringing children into this world is the biggest of decisions that 2 people should decide together and not by 1 whose paramount intention is to entrap the other.
As I remember, I wasn

[katya]

777, I am agree with you. Tests in love

[sean]

Katya, you have not understood what I wrote to 777. He did his own interpretation of everything. The funny part of it is, that he precisely analyzes sentence for sentence, but doesnt get the meaning. Well I think he inhalated too much adhesive from his bags that he was glueing or may be he smokes the same cigarettes like liam ? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

P.S. liam, hope u have a sense of http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[liam]

http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[777]

[QUOTE= (sean @ April 25 2003,15:13)]Katya, you have not understood what I wrote to 777. He did his own interpretation of everything. The funny part of it is, that he precisely analyzes sentence for sentence, but doesnt get the meaning. Well I think he inhalated too much adhesive from his bags that he was glueing or may be he smokes the same cigarettes like liam ? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

P.S. liam, hope u have a sense of

[sean]

777, irgendwie hast du ein gewaltiges Problem ! Ich würde es einmal mit weniger Kiffen probieren. Wahrscheinlich merkst du nicht wie lächerlich du dich mit deiner spirituellen Energie machst. Wenn du nicht so einen Stumpfsinn über andere Nationen verbreiten würdest, dann würde dich jeder in Ruhe lassen. Aber wie gesagt, war nur ein gutgemeinter Tip.

[katya]

Katya, you have not understood what I wrote to 777. He did his own interpretation of everything. The funny part of it is, that he precisely analyzes sentence for sentence, but doesnt get the meaning. Well I think he inhalated too much adhesive from his bags that he was glueing or may be he smokes the same cigarettes like liam ? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Sean , very funny, but I wasn

[sean]

Katya, does not matter, it was not important. This guy just drove me mad with his postings, but by now he is boring me.
So the best thing is just to ignore what he says. Sorry, but I cant take this guy for serious. May be it would have been more intelligent to ignore him from the very begining.

[777]

sean @ April 26 2003,05:52
sean @ April 26 2003,13:06

Congrats, sean! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

First you're trying to insult me furthermore, then you decided just to ignore me! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

You see, development is possible for everyone every day! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Fine that you stopped becoming a kind of Rascal! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[MartinUK]

777,
I have to disagree, there's only one prick like Rascal.

[777]

MartinUK @ April 28 2003,16:56

Rascal is probably kind of too young, but of course, I would be enthused if word choice and etiquette in this forum would reach higher levels.

At first, there

[777]

[QUOTE= (liam @ April 22 2003,20:37)]g'day 7, please enlighten me on the reason why "black american soldiers", "congolese" and "turkish people" are in germany in the first place http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Tom]

FYI,
I was never stationed in Germany (wish I had been http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif ), but I had always heard that the German girls absolutely LOVED the black guys. I can only gues why http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif . And I can think of at least three black guys in my unit who had German wives. I can't remember any white guys with German wives. But in fairness to those black guys, they WERE married to those German women...

[katya]

I am not racist, but I don

[liam]

i can see where katya's coming from. When i went to school in the northern england, there were'nt many coloured people and the ones who were pretty much got a big giant hard time. It was unlucky. Theres heaps of racism, many places were its definately dodgy to walk if your the wrong colour, you just would'nt bother. I used to go to the footy heaps and people used to through banana's at the black players!!!!!!
i really haven't a clue why it happens but there's definately, in a lot of people minds a "theres no black in the union jack" feeling. in louisianna i met people with some very spooky beliefs. its all the same everywhere. liam

[Serge]

[quote=777,April 29 2003,01:42]
FYI,
I was never stationed in Germany (wish I had been http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif ), but I had always heard that the German girls absolutely LOVED the black guys.

[liam]

hey serge, you've never mentioned before that you used to work with '7' http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif liam

[777]

[QUOTE= (liam @ May 01 2003,03:48)]hey serge, you've never mentioned before that you used to work with '7' http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[liam]

http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif ...so you remember me? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif liam

[Tom]

Speaking of race issues:

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tm....inter=1 (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=519&u=/ap/separate_proms&printer=1)

This is only about 60-70 miles from me.

[Vicky]

Speaking of races - those who you call Russian women are rarely genuinely Russian. We, as all other nations, are the mix of many nationalities. There's even a joke that all Russians are just the consequence of tatar-mongolian yoke http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

Vicky, you are right. It is so medley at blood. I wasn

[Tom]

Speaking of races - those who you call Russian women are rarely genuinely Russian. We, as all other nations, are the mix of many nationalities. There's even a joke that all Russians are just the consequence of tatar-mongolian yoke http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
I saw a program that claimed that the birth of the Russian nation (a little over 1000 years ago) might have been the responsibility of Vikings!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif Actually, it could be true.
The world is far more mixed up (nationaly a racialy) than most people realize. And it has been happening for 10s of 1000s of years!
It is always interesting to surmise that certain nationalities have certain characteristics 'in their blood'. Like "Southern Europeans are hot-headed." Or "Germans are all so fastidious and meticulous", (or Russian mothers love their children more, Katya http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif ), or whatever. But if only people knew the truth about their ancestry! Our differences are mostly cultural, not genetic.

[katya]

Tom! Are you again ? ;)
Try to argue this question on Russian. I

[Vicky]

Tom,
i'm not a historian unfortunately, but you dramatically reduced the history of Russians http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif It's not a thousand years this nation has been exsiting. It was christianized even ealier than that, and before that there was at least another thousand years of ancient Slavic people, living in communities, having pantheism like Greeks or Indians. Actually Slavic nation did appeal to Vikings when they had to stop "tribal" wars and some sources count this to be the start of Russia as a state, but not the nation, though even this point of view is highly doubtful. Other sources say Russia began from Scythian tribes whose history dates back to 6-5 century BC. Other thing is Hyperborea. Even Plato mentioned it, and another sources claim this was the true motherland of ancient Russians, and it existed in the times of Atlantis. Vikings might have influenced northern Russia though if speaking of phenotype, but they were not the fathers-founders http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[sean]

Well Tom, looks like you have got a good history lesson about Russian culture. Now lets see if you know North American history better http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Based on what you know about him in history books, what do you think Abraham Lincoln would be doing if he were alive today?

[Tom]

Tom,
i'm not a historian unfortunately, but you dramatically reduced the history of Russians http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif It's not a thousand years this nation has been exsiting. It was christianized even ealier than that, and before that there was at least another thousand years of ancient Slavic people, living in communities, having pantheism like Greeks or Indians. Actually Slavic nation did appeal to Vikings when they had to stop "tribal" wars and some sources count this to be the start of Russia as a state, but not the nation, though even this point of view is highly doubtful. Other sources say Russia began from Scythian tribes whose history dates back to 6-5 century BC. Other thing is Hyperborea. Even Plato mentioned it, and another sources claim this was the true motherland of ancient Russians, and it existed in the times of Atlantis. Vikings might have influenced northern Russia though if speaking of phenotype, but they were not the fathers-founders http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
First of all, I was quoting what some other historians have said (on one TV show), NOT what I personally proclaim to be the 'all inclusive history of Russia'! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Tom]

Vikings might have influenced northern Russia though if speaking of phenotype,
The *theory* goes that they had much influence in SOUTHERN Russia and perhaps mostly in what is now the Ukraine. In fact phenotypes (since you brought them up, but they are a very poor guide sometimes) are most similar between the vikings and modern Ukrainians.
It would be interesting if someone had study of genotypes, but this technology is in it's infancy and is still not completely reliable (primarily in it's analysis, if not the raw results.)
At the rate that things are now progressing in biological technologies, I think we will know a lot more about our origins before we are too much older, and we will not have to rely so much on legends and myths about our origins from the likes of Plato and Homer!

[Vicky]

Tom,
put away your shield, i'm not attacking http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif