Black list

[Karina]

It`s not fair to my mind that there are only women who are listed in a black list, we all know, that there are a lot of men who are eagerly come to cheat helpless women here, knowing in advance that there won`t be any punishment for them, they behave like kings of the world if they come overseas, they think that they are welcome to do anything they want, they break hearts of women, they meet not one woman during their trip, but 10-20 or even more if they have time and can afford themselves to buy, yes, to buy women`s love

[MechaBri]

you are right, men should also be held accountable for their actions.

[Oliar]

that's very pity when some men think that women are looking for money only, and it's so sad to see how man changes when we go to his country. In Russia they have impression that every girl will go with him just because he's foreigner, but it's defenetely not true

[ANYA]

[Gregory45]

There will be legislatio enter in the congress shortly concerning background check for men that will apply for a fiance visa, this background check includes a crimimal check along with any other matter related to the men. This information will be share with the ladies at the interview at the consulate before the visa is issue. So be aware guys that
you most be serious and free from any criminal background if you want to marry overseas. This legislation is been introduce by the senator from the state of Washington. There have been several serious cases regarding marriages to ladies from
Russian and Ukraine. So the woman will have some degree of
protection from the goverment.

[Randy]

Hey Gregory45,
This is only for the USA,is it not.This dose not include other countries.
I have not heard of Canada doing this or even talking about it.

Randy

[Tom]

My understanding is this:
When an American man brings over a lady from another country, the US Government does a very thorough background check on the woman.

[MartinUK]

Tom,
We have such a thing in UK called the 'Data Protection Act'. I reckon, in such a circumstance, this would forbid any third party divulging any personal information that they may hold on file about a person.
I see where you're coming from though but only in a circumstance whereas one party has withheld information or lied to the effect whereas it is something serious, let us say a convicted murder, child abuser or having been divorced 6 times already.
I don't have any such ghosts in the closet, I'm allowed to be remarkably honest with my current lady, obviously, in the time we have known each other I haven't had the time to tell her my entire life story, that will come in time but I'd rather it come from me rather than from some 'prick' in a goverment office.
It wouldn't be a case that I had withheld information, I simply haven't had time to tell it yet or the subject hasn't arisen, it will in time but I don't like to be rushed by some man in a suit!
Martin

[Tom]

Tom,
We have such a thing in UK called the 'Data Protection Act'. I reckon, in such a circumstance, this would forbid any third party divulging any personal information that they may hold on file about a person.

.........

It wouldn't be a case that I had withheld information, I simply haven't had time to tell it yet or the subject hasn't arisen, it will in time but I don't like to be rushed by some man in a suit!
Martin
Hey Martin,
We also have something similar called the 'Personal Information Act'.
Perhaps that is why they do not divulge any personal information to the 'foreign wives.' But they still divulge the wive's information to the men. I guess the women have no rights until they actually get here! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

My understanding is that they don't divulge this info to the man until the woman has already recieved the VISA. This also assumes, of course, that the two are already 'engaged.'

I think, at the point that she is about to leave her country, family, friends, job, etc. for an entirely new country to marry a man she has never even seen in his own environment, that it is only right that she know some basic biographical data on the guy, like criminal history and previous marriages.
It's not as though the FBI has a file on everybody and is going to divulge how many nights a week you visit the pub!!! (by the way, I know of another guy, who when asked by his future fiance about whether or not he drank alcohol, told her he did not drink. Well, when she got to America, it turned out the guy was both an alcoholic AND a drug addict. And that is the stuff the woman would NOT even be told about by the government unless he was somehow convicted on a related offense.)
Tom

PS I think you Europeans are at a distinct advantage (for both the man and women) because she can more easily visit you in your home town before committing to marriage.
Here in the US, once a woman arrives here, it more like she is past the 'point of no return', regardless of what she may find.

[MartinUK]

Tom,
For UK, at the interview stage, she is asked questions to test if she really knows the guy or not.
Such questions as where he lives and his date of birth, these questions might include, has he been married, does he have children etc.
If she consistently answers such questions incorrectly they're going to refuse her visa anyway and they do not have to give any reason for such a refusal.
So what's the problem, why does such a system need to change, if she answers correctly then she knows the guy and gets a visa, if she answers incorrectly then she doesn't get a visa until such time as she gets to know him better.
Quite a good system I'd say, no reason for change!

[Tom]

Martin,
I do know that the INS interviews the women and tries to determin whether on not the marriage is 'real' or not. I have no idea what questions they ask.
If they asked such questions as you mentioned and she answered the 100% correct, that would be great. That would be the perfect system for being sure that the women knew his basic biography, without the government having to actully 'tell' her anything.
But 'Might' ask her 'Some' of those questions and 'Will' ask her 'All' of those qustions (and expecting her to know 'All' the answers) are two different things.
What if one of those questions should be "How many of this man's previous wives have mysteriously disappeared?"... and they simply neglect to even ask that one?
Or how about the question "What are the names of this man's three previous wives?" And all there first names are 'Svetlana'...but they neglect to ask that question.
I think that is all relevent information that the woman NEEDS to know.
We are not talking about marrying the 'girl next door', after all.
We are talking about Immigration. Different rules apply.
There is a saying (that I just made up http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif ) that goes:
'If you want privacy, then don't go walking around in the nude, outdoors!' http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[MartinUK]

Tom,
I've told my current lady of 2 to 3 previous 'bad experience' girlfriends but whether their name was Sveta, Olga or Gertrude is of no relevance, that would be a ridiculous question to ask at a formal interview.
My lady doesn't ask me questions about my past, I volunteer the information but who gives a shit what an ex-girlfriends name was?
They could ask 'has he been married previously?' and 'why did they divorce?', if his previous wife was found floating upsidedown in a swimming pool but his lady answers that she died of cancer, then 'Houston, we have a problem!'
They don't need to tell her that he is a wife-killer. She has answered a somewhat important question incorrectly and at their discretion, they may refuse her a visa.
They shouldn't be asking standard questions, they should review the indivual application before the interview and ask questions specific to that application!
Tom, I'm actually quite enjoying this discussion, it's about the most mature discussion I've seen around here for a while now.

[eeyore]

There will be legislatio enter in the congress shortly concerning background check for men that will apply for a fiance visa, this background check includes a crimimal check along with any other matter related to the men. This information will be share with the ladies at the interview at the consulate before the visa is issue. So be aware guys that
you most be serious and free from any criminal background if you want to marry overseas. This legislation is been introduce by the senator from the state of Washington. There have been several serious cases regarding marriages to ladies from
Russian and Ukraine. So the woman will have some degree of
protection from the goverment.
Are you referring to this:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/07/05/politics/main561828.shtml

?
The Anastasia Solovieva King case - and the legislation inspired by it.

The news item is from July 5, 2003, I don't know what has happened since. (Perhaps the bill did not make it into law [?]).

Anyway, the 'problem' (lack of knowledge about criminal background) would apply even to partners from within USA!

[liam]

G'day http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

though its a little off-topic i thought i'd tell bout my own experiences when gaining NZ residency. I applied through the De-Facto relationship catagory. Basically i had to be with a NZ citizen for 2 years in a romantic, commited relationship! Well, here's the truth, Young Liam was no better than a 17 year old blond porn-star scammer from Belarus!

Even though i was a British Citizen i still had to have an interview at the NZ Embassy ( a fookin cheek if you ask me though cos we civilized the goddam place anyway http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif ).

I was asked 2 questions "Will you marry &^%$#@!, when you arrive in NZ?" I replied "No". The second question (believe it or not i was stumped big-time) was, "why do you want to move to NZ?" i really could'nt think of something to say so i replied, "cos the weather in englands really bad!" !!!!!!!!!!

Thats was it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i got the permit 2 days later!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But thats the NZ way i guess! and thats why its a little peice of old english paradise that i love

Cheers Liam

( only got 10 days left in russia http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif )

[MartinUK]

And because you like sheep, come on, admit it Liam!

[Tom]

From the article above:

"The industry markets stereotypes on both sides," Orloff said. "They market to the women the image of wealthy American men and a better life. They market to the American men the image of docile women they can control."
Such a pitch is offered by the Chance for Love matchmaking service. "The Russian woman has not been exposed to the world of rampant feminism that asserts its rights in America," its Web site says. "She is the weaker gender and knows it."

It is so true that these agencies paint completely false images of the people on bothe sides.

And the American men that I know who were 'ordering' these women really did believe that they were going to get a docile woman who 'never complains', etc.
Boy were they in for a shock when the women got here!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

I can tell you that the Russian women I know ARE very traditional in some respects... but they dont take any sh!it from there husbands! They have very strong personalities and wills.
On the other hand, they are traditional in that they do expect the man to take on the 'man's role' in the relationship...that is it is his responsibility to provide for and care for the family. They don't seem to like weak guys.
But that doesn't mean you can treat them like sh!t and expect them to still rub your feet when you get home!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[Tom]

I've told my current lady of 2 to 3 previous 'bad experience' girlfriends but whether their name was Sveta, Olga or Gertrude is of no relevance, that would be a ridiculous question to ask at a formal interview.
My lady doesn't ask me questions about my past, I volunteer the information but who gives a shit what an ex-girlfriends name was?
Martin,
The reason I mention the names of the wives is demonstrated in that article above...
That guy was on his second Russian wife and was already looking for his third while he was planning on killing his current one!!!
Of course serial marriages to foreign wives doesn't mean that eventually a murder will take place! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif But I think it has some relavance.
What if you found out that the woman you were about to marry had been married to American men three times already and had been deported back to the Ukraine three times? ANd additionally, you found this out from the government, because she had neglected to mention this to you personally? This is presuming you are already engeged to be married.

That is information that I'd like to know about...and if I have a right to know her past...then she has a right to know mine.
Tom

[MartinUK]

This is presuming you are already engeged to be married.

No Comment!!!

Tom,
But what difference does it make where she's from? Can you be sure that if you date etc. a local lady that she is not a serial killer or just escaped from Asylum?
I guess it's a question of thinking with one's head and not one's prick! Take that idiot MR. JA as an example, all he sees is a teenager with blonde hair, he'll say yes to anything because he's so desperate!
On the other hand, take things slowly and get to know your lady's mind, not just her date of birth and physical appearance.
With my current lady I can tell you her life story, there are no 'periods of absense' and it all makes sense.
To reiterate, a murder can take place in any relationship and I don't see why FSU should be singled out as a risk factor. Yes, we both have the right to know each others past but if one or both parties agree to marriage before they feel they have comfortably learnt about their partner, well they've only got themselves to blame if it all goes horribly wrong thereafter.

[Tom]

Yes, we both have the right to know each others past but if one or both parties agree to marriage before they feel they have comfortably learnt about their partner, well they've only got themselves to blame if it all goes horribly wrong thereafter.
Of course you are correct in that statement.
The problem is, many of the people getting married this way do NOT really know each other that well.
Perhaps it is their own fault. And learning these things from a government agency is certainly not the ideal way. But for many of these people, it might be the only way.
Take Mr. JA; Imagine he has previously 'imported' two or three 19 year old foriegn wives, who later turned up in Mexican brothels in Tiajuana...Don't you think the government should warn any future brides of such occurences, and not simply rely on MR. JA's good nature to reveal this info. himself?
You know, pimps can be very convincing...that is how they get these young women ensnared in the first place http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

Of course, I know I am going of into the rediculous here. I am with you in not wanting the government to go advertising my personal history without my consent.
But like I said in an earlier post; This is not the typical marriage we are talking about. It involves immigration and that opens up a whole other arena of potential abuses from both sides...both from the man who may be a sicko who knows he can't ensnare local chick and is hoping for a desperate girl with 'pipe dreams', and the women who may just be VISA whores. (perhaps they deserve each other?)

Like you keep saying, you simply have to be very carefull and just plain smart about how you go about this. But most people in this world are not so carefull and not so smart!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[MartinUK]

Tom,
If a guy, any guy, has previously imported 3 ladies that thereafter ended-up in brothels, and the goverment know this, then they should 'blacklist' any further import applications from him.
The authorities repeatedly say that they do not have to give the reason why a visa has been refused, they simply refuse his applications, give no reason, the lady is safe, and JA will still be jerking-off!
These ladies are amongst the most intelligent in the world. Yes, a percentage will go with such a jerk for the wrong reasons but at the end of the day, it will be her own stipid fault. I accept this might not be a perfect scenario but then life ain't perfect!
I do understand where you are coming from though Tom.

[eeyore]

liam,
about your emigration/immigration:
" I was asked 2 questions "Will you marry &^%$#@!, when you arrive in NZ?" I replied "No". The second question (believe it or not i was stumped big-time) was, "why do you want to move to NZ?" i really could'nt think of something to say so i replied, "cos the weather in englands really bad!" !!!!!!!!!!"

Would you/Did you marry &^%$#@! ?
If you did not, your answer was correct.
Your answer to the second question certainly *was* correct.

They must have thought, "Here we have an honest Pommie" and let you into NooZealand.
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[liam]

http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif no mate, we never did get married http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

and as you well know, theres no such thing as an honest Pom http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Nataliya]

It`s not fair to my mind that there are only women who are listed in a black list, we all know, that there are a lot of men who are eagerly come to cheat helpless women here, knowing in advance that there won`t be any punishment for them, they behave like kings of the world if they come overseas, they think that they are welcome to do anything they want, they break hearts of women, they meet not one woman during their trip, but 10-20 or even more if they have time and can afford themselves to buy, yes, to buy women`s love
Karina,

You can blacklist your men-scummers here Men- scummers Blacklist (http://antidate.fastbb.ru/)

[nordsyd]

There are also men there are looking after serious girls and not prostituts. I have two times try to invited a girl to my contry. booths time it happen to be girls that for long time have work as prostitut (i did not know there what they have before it is first when you spent time with you find out of that) and dont see anything wrong in that(the girl). where i live it is not normally life and in some part of FSU it seem that men treat girls like object that you pay for and buy and the girl have got use to that and take it with them when they travle abroad, i have also meet girl that same norms that we have.