Why there are so many americans, which isn't seri

[katya]

Why there are so many americans, which isn't seriouse?
Lads, what are you looking for ?

My question too! Reply to an American and you are then ignored. My method? I ignore Americans completely. Possibly most are trophy hunters, collectors of photographs and are husbands. Look to Europe or Australia, places where many friends have successfully met and married and are now enjoying stable, blissful lives full of love and, NOTE, trust.

[snosbigger]

Well ladies. All Americans are not married, and are not trophy hunters, and don't deserve to be ignored. To lump us all together in such a derogatory manner accomplishes nothing. Some of us are quite serious and could sometimes have jusy the same type of negatives to say about the Russian girls if we wanted to. This is not easy, and there are some jerks on both sides of the ocean. Pick your mates and good luck to us all with the search.

[cere42]

Americans are as serious as Europeans or Austaralians.
People are People regardless their origin.
Perhaps you did not find the Right one yet.
Keep Looking and searching...-
Cere http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

</span>Well ladies. All Americans are not married, and are not trophy hunters, and don't deserve to be ignored. To lump us all together in such a derogatory manner accomplishes nothing. Some of us are quite serious and could sometimes have jusy the same type of negatives to say about the Russian girls if we wanted to. This is not easy, and there are some jerks on both sides of the ocean. Pick your mates and good luck to us all with the search.<span =''>
Hi !

The long of the short is this.

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 22 2002,10:50)]The long of the short is this.

[Chris]

The real problem is not with the fake woman , it is with the woman who are evil . http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif I was reading about a guy the other day on another message board who wrote to a woman almost everyday and talked to her on the phone several times a week. Then it came time for him to meet her he sent her plane tickets so she could fly to Poland . That added up to 1800.00 so then the day before they are supposed to meet in Warsaw she told him that she was mugged and that her plane ticket was stolen and that she needed the money to purchase another ticket ... well on such short notice the ticket was 3000.00 , but he was blind by love but not a complete fool he bought the ticket himself . She was disappointed that he did not trust her but she agreed to meet him . He flew all the way there , only to find nobody waiting for him at the airport ...in fact he never heard from her again even after 1 year of writing and phone calls . It hard to know who is real and who is not even if you feel you know them like the back of your hand .

Persoanlly i am real and i am serious . Finding a woman with common interests it a lot of trouble though. Anyone out there like Art , Web , Dancing , Clubbing , Travel....LOL http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

You have to plow through the weeds to find the flowers!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif[QUOTE]

[bigtime401]

</span></span>[QUOTE= (snosbigger @ Sep. 22 2002,06:20)]Well ladies. All Americans are not married, and are not trophy hunters, and don't deserve to be ignored. To lump us all together in such a derogatory manner accomplishes nothing. Some of us are quite serious and could sometimes have jusy the same type of negatives to say about the Russian girls if we wanted to. This is not easy, and there are some jerks on both sides of the ocean. Pick your mates and good luck to us all with the search.<span =''>
Hi !

[bobby]

How rude to dispose of American men as a whole to describe them as all not being serious, only after sex! Giving other women advice to ingore american men and look torwards europeans or australians is ridiculous! Don't you know that all men are the same no matter where they live? Do you actually think men such as myself would waste our time looking for sincere women in foreign countries on the other side of the world just for sex? I can not speak for anyone except myself when I say the whole reason I am interested in Russian women is because of their strong family desires and absolute companionship unlike american women.

[katya]

</span></span>[QUOTE= (katya @ Sep. 22 2002,10:40)]</span>[QUOTE= (snosbigger @ Sep. 22 2002,06:20)]Well ladies. All Americans are not married, and are not trophy hunters, and don't deserve to be ignored. To lump us all together in such a derogatory manner accomplishes nothing. Some of us are quite serious and could sometimes have jusy the same type of negatives to say about the Russian girls if we wanted to. This is not easy, and there are some jerks on both sides of the ocean. Pick your mates and good luck to us all with the search.<span =''>
Hi !

[katya]

</span>How rude to dispose of American men as a whole to describe them as all not being serious, only after sex! Giving other women advice to ingore american men and look torwards europeans or australians is ridiculous! Don't you know that all men are the same no matter where they live? Do you actually think men such as myself would waste our time looking for sincere women in foreign countries on the other side of the world just for sex? I can not speak for anyone except myself when I say the whole reason I am interested in Russian women is because of their strong family desires and absolute companionship unlike american women.<span =''>
interesting....
How you can speak about all american women ? ;)
I think , that good women are in all country. And in America too.
But it is harder to find such woman there.
and I know, that there are some good American men. But I wasn't meet any - let we think , that I am unlucky in it.

I was corresponding with a Russian girl who seemed very nice and genuine. She told me she was going to be coming to America with a medical group and would be in my city and that we she wanted to spend all of her free time with me. I am a very nice looking guy and pride myself as a true gentleman. She told me that she had never been with a man before and wanted to give herself to me. A few weeks before she was supposed to visit I recieved a sad message from her saying her father had died and she was sad that she couldn't give him a proper and respectfull funeral and asked for $20.00 from me with instructions on where to wire the money. Suddenly her broken English was perfect with absolute precise instructions on where and how to wire the money. I also had previously asked about her flight information such as airline, flight numbers and was not given specific information. I know of another board with many seasoned travelers to Russia and they all say the Mafia runs everything in Russia and to be aware and always sceptical. It is sad for the genuine ladys from Russia and the perspective men in America.

[cere42]

Naive Naive Naive!!!
Most of the Women in Russia are highly educated, well read, sophisticated, romantic and good looking.
Unfortunately, they all experienced financial hardship and lack of basic necessities. And combination of all of the above makes them difficult for us to understand.
Therefore, before you start dreaming of the Gorgeous, Educated Russian Virgin as your wife, learn how to deal with such. Loose your VINI VIDI VICI attitude; be reasonable with your demands. You do not deserve 10-30 years younger partner just because

I am from Canada,
Here we love the person for who they are and not how much they have.

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (cere42 @ Sep. 25 2002,03:19)]Naive Naive Naive!!!
Most of the Women in Russia are highly educated, well read, sophisticated, romantic and good looking.
Unfortunately, they all experienced financial hardship and lack of basic necessities. And combination of all of the above makes them difficult for us to understand.
Therefore, before you start dreaming of the Gorgeous, Educated Russian Virgin as your wife, learn how to deal with such. Loose your VINI VIDI VICI attitude; be reasonable with your demands. You do not deserve 10-30 years younger partner just because

[scob49]

I would like to ask you Russian ladies why do you submit your adds if you don't have intentions about reply to the letters send to you...? I have been writing to many and never got any reply on my letters.

[scob49]

</span>Why there are so many americans, which isn't seriouse?
Lads, what are you looking for ?<span =''>
Like to pass this question along to the Russian Ladies...? What are you looking for...?

[katya]

</span></span>Why there are so many americans, which isn't seriouse?
Lads, what are you looking for ?<span =''>
Like to pass this question along to the Russian Ladies...? What are you looking for...?<span =''>
I cannot speak about all. I am looking for a Man.
and , when I see first letter from man , where I am not see ever my name - I am understanding, that this letter is one for a lot of girls. I am not first , and not lust.
and sometimes it is looking like joke. A man , who 60 years old writing to me.
We have good song. If it'll translate, it'll be *
before you will marry on the young girl , open your passport and look in it. You'll understand all, you'll look all yourself*
thank for a question ! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif Katya

Ladies I want you all to know that American men are not bad, They want what every man in this world wants, and that is to be happy in life and to spend the rest of their lives with a beautiful woman that is as wonderful on the inside as she appears to him on the outside. American men are honest and patriotic and stand up for what they belive in. Wouldn't you want a man that will stand up for you to the very end that wont cower from the fearful things in this world? Perhaps that is just me, I was raised as a southern gentleman and now have the privelage to prove it as a United States Marine. Yes you've got your bad ones, don't get me wrong but for the most part I have met nothing but truly good hearted, honest American men. Don't be discouraged. Life has its funny little ways of working things out for us. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[DJ JeF-C]

why are americans so hated.?

</span>[QUOTE= (cere42 @ Sep. 25 2002,03:19)]Naive Naive Naive!!!
Most of the Women in Russia are highly educated, well read, sophisticated, romantic and good looking.
Unfortunately, they all experienced financial hardship and lack of basic necessities. And combination of all of the above makes them difficult for us to understand.
Therefore, before you start dreaming of the Gorgeous, Educated Russian Virgin as your wife, learn how to deal with such. Loose your VINI VIDI VICI attitude; be reasonable with your demands. You do not deserve 10-30 years younger partner just because

</span>[QUOTE= (cere42 @ Sep. 25 2002,03:19)]Naive Naive Naive!!!
Most of the Women in Russia are highly educated, well read, sophisticated, romantic and good looking.
Unfortunately, they all experienced financial hardship and lack of basic necessities. And combination of all of the above makes them difficult for us to understand.
Therefore, before you start dreaming of the Gorgeous, Educated Russian Virgin as your wife, learn how to deal with such. Loose your VINI VIDI VICI attitude; be reasonable with your demands. You do not deserve 10-30 years younger partner just because

[cere42]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 29 2002,18:18)]</span>[QUOTE= (cere42 @ Sep. 25 2002,03:19)]Naive Naive Naive!!!
Most of the Women in Russia are highly educated, well read, sophisticated, romantic and good looking.
Unfortunately, they all experienced financial hardship and lack of basic necessities. And combination of all of the above makes them difficult for us to understand.
Therefore, before you start dreaming of the Gorgeous, Educated Russian Virgin as your wife, learn how to deal with such. Loose your VINI VIDI VICI attitude; be reasonable with your demands. You do not deserve 10-30 years younger partner just because

[Fabrizio]

Reading what has been written over here, I get the feeling that American guys and Russian women just don't seem to interact very well, to be honest with you all, it seems to me that many Americans are looking for this perfect family-oriented woman, who can dedicate 100% to them, good tradition and so on...
On the other side we have many intelligent and actually keen woman who really look for genuine love, maybe because their experience haven't been positive in Russia, and we all know we look outside the window when we're deceived to see if there's anything different.
The problem is that some other women are actually trying to escape their situation, and they may in some cases take advantage of their influence over tender-seekers, who are just waiting for a woman to tell them how sweet they are and/or how they look forward to be in bed with them...
I believe there is a certain number of these cases, but I haven't got enough knowledge and contacts to tell how many and whether guys should trust Russian women or not.
What I feel I want to tell anyone over here, no matter where they come from, no matter they are men or women, is that sometimes it takes some common sense, and most of all it's honesty which plays the highest role in all these situations.
So, a guy could eventually say he's looking just for some company, just for sex maybe, or he's looking for serious stuff. On the other hand, a woman should make clear whether she will look for love, and not only a comfortable life, because this opens the way to honest communication by both sides, and if intentions are clear this is the first step to be friends (assured friendship is what everything should start from).
And, to finish this long post with a joke, if there are too many Americans over here, Katya, how about this 32 year old Italian? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Bye
Fabrizio

[Fabrizio]

</span>[QUOTE= (cere42 @ Sep. 29 2002,18:51)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 29 2002,18:18)]</span>[QUOTE= (cere42 @ Sep. 25 2002,03:19)]Naive Naive Naive!!!
Most of the Women in Russia are highly educated, well read, sophisticated, romantic and good looking.
Unfortunately, they all experienced financial hardship and lack of basic necessities. And combination of all of the above makes them difficult for us to understand.
Therefore, before you start dreaming of the Gorgeous, Educated Russian Virgin as your wife, learn how to deal with such. Loose your VINI VIDI VICI attitude; be reasonable with your demands. You do not deserve 10-30 years younger partner just because

Americans are brainless bastards.

Americans are brainless bastards.

</span></span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 30 2002,20:16)]<span =''>
Americans are brainless bastards.

Hey, i don't know which americans you have been talkin to, but I'm not married and i'm just as serious about relationships as you guys, I don't try to be a player, or just put on a act to get sex, I'm honest and have been tryin to find a woman who is mature enough to take a relationship seriously. ANyways, I guess I kinda do know where you are coming form I do have friends that are players and are lookin for sex and nothin more. But that isn't all americans, just some, and that goes for other origins too.

[katya]

</span>[quote=Guest,Sep. 30 2002,20:16]
Americans are brainless bastards.

[DJ JeF-C]

</span>[quote=Guest,Sep. 30 2002,20:16]
Americans are brainless bastards.

Why are so many Americans not serious?

Because there are 250 million Americans. Many of the men of which use the internet. Chances are 90% of the men you're going to be contacted by are American. You're just seeing the statistics of large numbers.

I'm a proud Canadian and know beyond a reasonable doubt that certain men from any country are just clowns whether they are from the U.S. or Australia, U.K. or Canada for that matter. I'm sure Russia has screwed up men. The answer to the question is because all you ever get is American men that respond to Russian women a large percentage of the time.

In Canada if I want to date a Russian lady, I have plenty of them here already. I dated a Ukranian girl once. They are no different than Canadian ladies. Some are bitches some are nice. It's like that no matter what country you're in.

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,13:52)]Why are so many Americans not serious?

Because there are 250 million Americans.

</span>[1. I do'nt eat mcdonald's only pure organic food.

2. I work out everyday and have two degrees so when i see monslovics like yourself i am able to shoot you down physically or mentally.

3. as far as history , we are one of the youngest developments in recent history dumb ass and people in america are all from other countries to begin with, unless your native american indian.
White americans are europe decent..

4. "classics" i dont know what you mean of this but if we are talking movies i don't have to remind you where Hollywood is do I..?

5. music well lets see we invented blues, jazz, rock,techno and house music to name a few..

6. as far as how we treat women, haha look at how the middle east treats thiers, and remember we have some of the most powerfull women in the world because we have a nation that encourages them to be their own persons,American women like to be independent and free to thier own needs and we like to give them the room to do it.

jelous are we ..?<span =''>
Shocking that someone who purports to have 2 university degrees can have such an appalling command of his own language that he can't even post to an Internet forum without more spelling and grammatical mistakes than sentences in his posting! Truly the standard of education is higher in Russia (and in most countries) than in America. It makes you wonder why more of these wonderful Russian girls don't despair of American men altogether. Many of them have a better command of English than you do!

[oshalaby]

My dear ladies, why everything is concentrated on american and european citizens especially men, i have to say something here, its the human nature, if someone feels that he is wanted because of his life style , good economic status, and i mention here that all russian ladies are looking for american men, and this gives the chance to any anerican men to ignore to play some internet games because all men that put ads, they know that russian woman are in need to them, this is the important point. I dont want any body to be offended especially american and european men, and i know there are many repectful men and very repectful woman here and there which are looking seriously to find their mate, but of course the chances to find serious persons which are looking trully for their mate goes to the side of the russian ladies because they want to move from the country.
My dear ladies u can find many , i mean many setrious men all around the world, dont look for a life standard and make it ur first priority, this will have a very big chance to let u choose wrong, choose the person from all over the world, if u found ur soul in him , even if it is a thirld world country, ur life will be terrific, because love and respect to the right person between u both will remove all barriers for a better life and a happy one.
Thanks for giving me this chance to comment

</span></span>[1. I do'nt eat mcdonald's only pure organic food.

2. I work out everyday and have two degrees so when i see monslovics like yourself i am able to shoot you down physically or mentally.

3. as far as history , we are one of the youngest developments in recent history dumb ass and people in america are all from other countries to begin with, unless your native american indian.
White americans are europe decent..

4. "classics" i dont know what you mean of this but if we are talking movies i don't have to remind you where Hollywood is do I..?

5. music well lets see we invented blues, jazz, rock,techno and house music to name a few..

6. as far as how we treat women, haha look at how the middle east treats thiers, and remember we have some of the most powerfull women in the world because we have a nation that encourages them to be their own persons,American women like to be independent and free to thier own needs and we like to give them the room to do it.

jelous are we ..?<span =''>

Shocking that someone who purports to have 2 university degrees can have such an appalling command of his own language that he can't even post to an Internet forum without more spelling and grammatical mistakes than sentences in his posting! Truly the standard of education is higher in Russia (and in most countries) than in America. It makes you wonder why more of these wonderful Russian girls don't despair of American men altogether. Many of them have a better command of English than you do!<span =''>
You're absolutely right. He makes 9 spelling mistakes just in the little fragment that you've quoted, and that's without thinking about the grammar at all (you need a strong stomach to read some of this drivel ... how do men like this seriously expect an educated woman to be interested in them???).

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,14:48)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,13:52)]Why are so many Americans not serious?

Because there are 250 million Americans.

[phil]

To those interested parties:I have travelled to Ukraine and also have friends here in Philadelphia as well,and would share some of my experience regarding Katya's assertions concerning American males(not all deserve the title of men).I met a beautiful young woman 15 years my junior(I also have dated women in the US 15 or more years younger,and older for that matter) and travelled to see her in Odessa.It was the best decision I have ever made.WE corresponded for 2 months and learned agreat deal about each other.I was not unwary and had already been stung by the group of scammers in Kremenchug but I went willingly.My friend there never revealed herself completely but most of it was real.I succumbed to the desire of love and beauty,but her reality is different.I loved the time I was in Ukraine,the people and culture eclipse the the consumption based materialistic culture in the US.But Americans don't tolerate an overloard knowingly,keep us satiated and diverted and we are the same.Take a chance on us ladies,we are struggling to keep a dream alive,as you are.I seek an Eastern European woman for a wife,to build my family.I am 45 and work to this goal.Many opportunists attempt to denegrate our effort.Do not let them succed.

[katya]

</span>To those interested parties:I have travelled to Ukraine and also have friends here in Philadelphia as well,and would share some of my experience regarding Katya's assertions concerning American males(not all deserve the title of men).I met a beautiful young woman 15 years my junior(I also have dated women in the US 15 or more years younger,and older for that matter) and travelled to see her in Odessa.It was the best decision I have ever made.WE corresponded for 2 months and learned agreat deal about each other.I was not unwary and had already been stung by the group of scammers in Kremenchug but I went willingly.My friend there never revealed herself completely but most of it was real.I succumbed to the desire of love and beauty,but her reality is different.I loved the time I was in Ukraine,the people and culture eclipse the the consumption based materialistic culture in the US.But Americans don't tolerate an overloard knowingly,keep us satiated and diverted and we are the same.Take a chance on us ladies,we are struggling to keep a dream alive,as you are.I seek an Eastern European woman for a wife,to build my family.I am 45 and work to this goal.Many opportunists attempt to denegrate our effort.Do not let them succed.<span =''>
and what about that girl from Odessa ?

i don't know why americans are so loud well i speak about an other problem and excuse for my english.why the board is not in italian? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif well girls from russian ukraine moldavia don't accept to come in an occidental country if you found for exemple a job as shop assistant, waitress.95% of the time it's in reality synonimous of prostitution , poverty, slavery,degeneration,drugs.life is difficult maybe in your country but can be more difficult here don't forget that.the streets of the big europeans cities are crowd of girls from the eastern countries around my age and it's scandalous.don't dream of a wonderful job we don't have a lot of free jobs in europe for europeans so for russians.i think the people who fuck with prostitutes are more stupid than people who want love with a russian woman and marriage with her.well ciao .

http://prostitutionresearch.com

"Trafficking in women for the purpose of sexual exploitation is a multi-billion dollar shadow market. Women are trafficked to, from, and through every region in the world using methods that have become new forms of slavery. The value of the global trade in women as commodities for sex industries is estimated to be between seven and twelve billion dollars annually. This trade in women is a highly profitable enterprise with relatively low risk compared to trades in drugs or arms. The moneymakers are transnational networks of traffickers and pimps that prey on the dreams of women seeking employment and opportunities for the future. The activities of these networks threaten the well being and status of women as well as the social, political and economic well being and stability of nations where they operate."

I had the same experiance I am a American I sent money to a Russian for Papers to come to America guess what I have never Heard from Her since. I have sent flowers and even a Teddy bear. I tried Letters email and finally given Up. she said she did not have a Phone and I thought that was normal by what she had told me. I am out 2000.00 dollars. So I quite responding to women from any country on the net. Not Just Russian or American or British I guess you just have to be very Careful about wht you do and not send money of anykind

Katya,you ask,I respond.I arrived in Ods,via Kiev.My friend was not at the bus stop so I went to the house listed on her passport and met her Mama.She then arrived shortly and we proceeded to the flat she had rented for the summer(I provided 500 to facilitate this via W.U.)She was very concerned with my behavior and cautioned me to not display affection openly,even hand holding.The first evening after a day at the beach,and a great dinner,she told me it was inappropriate for her to staythe night.I assured her that my intentions were honorable and that I would stay outside the bedroom.She acquiesced and we spent the night intimately and my intention was now completely to marry her.Over the course of the next week
,I made some mistakes,which she called me on,some were cultural (,others were not.She was concerned that if her ex discovered that she was seeing a forgeiner that it would be catastrophic in retaining custody of her son(12 this feb) and explained the private nature of our relations.She continued to have meetings,with friends usually 7-10 in the evenings and once left in the middle of a romantic dinner.I felt some of this behavior unexplainable and it was a cause for strong words between us.I was strongly attracted to her,in all respects,and she was very responsive to me.As I was leaving she told me she agreed to be with me,that I was strong enough.During the course of my stay there was very little interaction with family or friends of any kind.She was an excellent guide and host.She told me she makes 500 per month managing some retail outlets in the city.A week after my return she wanted me to send her3500 to pay a debt to her friend.I was unable at that moment to do it,although I would have perhaps reluctantly if things were different.(meaning my cash flow)
It was our plan to buy a flat in Odessa but to facilitate this I had to liquidate some assets.Due to US economic downturn it has taken longer than expected.In the meantime life goes on.I am regretful that I have been unable to execute my end to date,but it will occur shortly.I will return and discuss options with her,but I have seen a different perspective.I am writing not to condemn my friend,She is a great person,but her reality is harsh and causes her to behave differently than I expected.I do wonder,am suspicious(character flaw)you would think 500 per month would permit a comfortable lifestyle.Am I mistaken?Of course correspondence has dwindled and we are perhaps just getting on with our lives seperately.I write for a womann's perspective Katya,your words impress me.Maybe your youth provides you with a clearer vision.I do not wish to exploit the women of eastern europe,I disagree heartily with Hank who brags of his exploits and 40 trips etc. etc.I seek a beautiful woman,true.Younger than me yes,But I am not a poor specimen physically,opposite is true.I seek my mate for creation of loving family,children,tradition

</span>You have to plow through the weeds to find the flowers!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif[QUOTE]<span =''>
It is a pitty there are so many weeds that look like flowers. I myself had three ladies in a row that promised to come and meet. I sent them the money and never hurd from them anymore. But still I found a rare pearl that makes me forget all the troubles I had before. I would like to have an official adres where I could give the names and adresses from the scammers. Greetz from Ronz Umpire http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[dragohawk]

After reading your message I believe it should be stated that if you are asked for sex then you dont have to say yes, It may be better to say that you wish to know the person better or that you believe sex should be more spontanious, it may be the person you are corresponding with is predatorial and does this on a regular basis so when he arrives in your country he has several women lined up for sex all feeling obliged to do so.
This type of thing is as bad as the dating scams that make it increasingly hard to find someone and not be suspicous about there motives, I myself found someone who I though would be perfect and then poured my heart out to her, wrote poems etc and then was asked for money..while I understand the economic situation in russia this same person after breaking contct with me due to money problems then posted on a different site.
My attitude to this is be careful, watch for signs if the person is sincere he will continue contact even if refused sex, you should not feel obliged to give sex instead retain you moral ground, "single" is better than "single with child"

[MightyMarine]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 30 2002,20:16)]Americans are brainless bastards.

dude Hoo rah and semper Fi but get over it!If you don't know that we opress other cultures in order to have cheap gas and burgers you are lost! of course we are imperialistic,the problem is we do what we do in the name of America but to (for)the benefit of multi-nationals that only care about THEIR bottom line!That guy is right about our foreign policy,he's just dead wrong about us man.Just so you understand,Russian men are weak,they dominate and bully.Their mafia are scammers,prey on the weak and run from anyone that has the balls to die fighting back!I live in Philly and know of what I speak.Just don't let them have numbers.Russian women are the strength of their nation,turned the tide in WWII on the front lines in combat.

[liam]

Mighty marine: you are the absolute embodiment of why a huge majority of the world have a big laugh at your disney republic, you talk about your "beloved leader" , that in-itself harks back to the days of hitler, stalin, idi amin and everyother tin-pot dictator the 20th century has unfortunately borne. Your leaders are voted in by big buisness and money and thats it. Your incessant flag waving and military banter belies the fact that since WW2 your only success in any type of fight has come against caribbean banana republics that half-a-dozen school-boys and a couple of water-pistols could've over-thrown with ridiculous ease.
If a real fight comes along you guys really don't have the stomach to face it head on: aka somalia. If i was the parent of one of those boys killed i'd be mighty proud of my government!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
I served with the Royal Marines, I'm only glad that now I'm no longer involved where my life could so easily be sacrificed because some idiots father in the us was made to look a little bit silly by saddam more than a decade ago. If you want to look at real, bonafide heroes look at the people of the old soviet union circa 1943, the british who stood totally alone in 1940 and the students of tianamin square, china. Not to a country where its leaders either wear womens underwear, can't admit to smoking a joint, find themselves in a state of uncontrollable lust around chubby interns or consult astrology to form foreign policy.

OK this is not about leaders president or culture bashing this was about why American men are to put it bluntly assholes sorry but we are. I am a American I will stand behind our flag. But #### we are the only hypocrital country I have ever seen we send money to foreign country but let our own people starve. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif I am not happy with it and Yes our last President was a Boob. I agree we also have had some real bad ones in the past I agree but we as a Nation are quiet lazy and expect everyone to fall at our feets when we walk into a room. I will defend our country I will pick up a weapon and Fight our wars but get real we are arrogent and egotistical. So lets get back to the topic at hand and stop the flame thank you http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[katya]

</span>Katya,you ask,I respond.I arrived in Ods,via Kiev.My friend was not at the bus stop so I went to the house listed on her passport and met her Mama.She then arrived shortly and we proceeded to the flat she had rented for the summer(I provided 500 to facilitate this via W.U.)She was very concerned with my behavior and cautioned me to not display affection openly,even hand holding.The first evening after a day at the beach,and a great dinner,she told me it was inappropriate for her to staythe night.I assured her that my intentions were honorable and that I would stay outside the bedroom.She acquiesced and we spent the night intimately and my intention was now completely to marry her.Over the course of the next week
,I made some mistakes,which she called me on,some were cultural (,others were not.She was concerned that if her ex discovered that she was seeing a forgeiner that it would be catastrophic in retaining custody of her son(12 this feb) and explained the private nature of our relations.She continued to have meetings,with friends usually 7-10 in the evenings and once left in the middle of a romantic dinner.I felt some of this behavior unexplainable and it was a cause for strong words between us.I was strongly attracted to her,in all respects,and she was very responsive to me.As I was leaving she told me she agreed to be with me,that I was strong enough.During the course of my stay there was very little interaction with family or friends of any kind.She was an excellent guide and host.She told me she makes 500 per month managing some retail outlets in the city.A week after my return she wanted me to send her3500 to pay a debt to her friend.I was unable at that moment to do it,although I would have perhaps reluctantly if things were different.(meaning my cash flow)
It was our plan to buy a flat in Odessa but to facilitate this I had to liquidate some assets.Due to US economic downturn it has taken longer than expected.In the meantime life goes on.I am regretful that I have been unable to execute my end to date,but it will occur shortly.I will return and discuss options with her,but I have seen a different perspective.I am writing not to condemn my friend,She is a great person,but her reality is harsh and causes her to behave differently than I expected.I do wonder,am suspicious(character flaw)you would think 500 per month would permit a comfortable lifestyle.Am I mistaken?Of course correspondence has dwindled and we are perhaps just getting on with our lives seperately.I write for a womann's perspective Katya,your words impress me.Maybe your youth provides you with a clearer vision.I do not wish to exploit the women of eastern europe,I disagree heartily with Hank who brags of his exploits and 40 trips etc. etc.I seek a beautiful woman,true.Younger than me yes,But I am not a poor specimen physically,opposite is true.I seek my mate for creation of loving family,children,tradition<span =''>
Hi!
I think , all will be good. And you'll find your woman. becouse each norman woman dreaming about good husband, good family and children. And woman willn't look are you rich or not, if she love you. She'll try to help you, if you'll need in it - and if not, too http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif)))))
I know, that it is hurd - but if you really looking for , you'll find.

[katya]

</span>I had the same experiance I am a American I sent money to a Russian for Papers to come to America guess what I have never Heard from Her since. I have sent flowers and even a Teddy bear. I tried Letters email and finally given Up. she said she did not have a Phone and I thought that was normal by what she had told me. I am out 2000.00 dollars. So I quite responding to women from any country on the net. Not Just Russian or American or British I guess you just have to be very Careful about wht you do and not send money of anykind<span =''>
you know..
Be happy, that you lose only 2000 $. She was can ask you more ^))))
It is first.
Second. Papers isn't take such money - don't believe !
but you need time.
and ... I don't know, how you cannot understand- if girl ask you about money , it means, that she need in your money, but not at you.
And, answer me, for what you need such girl ?

[katya]

</span>After reading your message I believe it should be stated that if you are asked for sex then you dont have to say yes, It may be better to say that you wish to know the person better or that you believe sex should be more spontanious, it may be the person you are corresponding with is predatorial and does this on a regular basis so when he arrives in your country he has several women lined up for sex all feeling obliged to do so.
This type of thing is as bad as the dating scams that make it increasingly hard to find someone and not be suspicous about there motives, I myself found someone who I though would be perfect and then poured my heart out to her, wrote poems etc and then was asked for money..while I understand the economic situation in russia this same person after breaking contct with me due to money problems then posted on a different site.
My attitude to this is be careful, watch for signs if the person is sincere he will continue contact even if refused sex, you should not feel obliged to give sex instead retain you moral ground, "single" is better than "single with child"<span =''>
better not answer them at all. If man stuped - it is for long time.
and for what lose your time on such man ? and money too http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif)) Really, Internet in Russia is dear toy http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (MightyMarine @ Oct. 08 2002,02:23)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 30 2002,20:16)]Americans are brainless bastards.

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 08 2002,14:48)]OK this is not about leaders president or culture bashing this was about why American men are to put it bluntly assholes sorry but we are. I am a American I will stand behind our flag. But #### we are the only hypocrital country I have ever seen we send money to foreign country but let our own people starve.

</span>[quote=Guest,Oct. 02 2002,13:52]
I hate to say this...but, isn't Canada part of the U.S.?

Be a proud Canadian if you want, but please don't start with the U.S. because most people in Canada have friends and family in the U.S. and think of themselves as cousins...

I'm a proud American!!!

Get a life and off the soapbox...ok!!!

Jon<span =''>
Only some dumb uneducated fool would even be stupid enough to say something as idiotic as, "Isn't Canada part of the U.S.?" That's right and Canada has an emporer and he's considering taking over the world. Canadians hide in our igloo's all winter long eating seal meat and killing caraboo as a cover for our real intentions to take over Iceland as our first step towards world domination.

I am the prince of Canada. Canada is the 51st state of the U.S.A. Al Gore is really my dad you know.
You're a moron JON!!! Cousins eh, that's why Americans boo our NHL Hockey teams when they play in the U.S. right, that's why President George Bush mentioned every friggin' country in the world for thanks regarding the 9/11 tragedy but somehow managed to leave Canada out of that list to thank. That's why Americans boo the Canadian national anthem both in hockey and basketball and baseball right JON.

The only cousins in the U.S. is the one you married you dumbass southerner. That's why the North one you fag, cuz you hicks are just plain dumb.

"I'm not a lumberjack or a fur trader. I don't live in an igloo or eat blubber or own a dog sled. And I don't know Jimmy, Sally or Suzy from Canada, although I'm certain they're really, really nice. I have a prime minister, not a president. I speak English and French, not American. And I pronounce it "about", not "aboot". I can proudly sew my country's flag on my backpack abroad. I believe in peacekeeping, not policing. Diversity, not assimilation. And that the beaver is a truly proud and noble animal. A toque is a hat, a chesterfield is a couch. And it is pronounced zed, not zee, zed. Canada is the second largest landmass, the first nation of hockey and the best part of North America. My name is MAX, and I AM CANADIAN!"

Thank you.

[liam]

Katya, as you said "the world is big enough"


'You lose nothing by it;
You just play the fool
And the lord will, forgive you.
You know it's forbidden
To no one in Russia
To bow and be silent.'

Nekrasov

[Aercher]

Katya I agree about everything you have said. But then I am just a fool and di not htink about any of this plus she did contact me out of the blue. I guess when you see a pretty face and you are smitten by the email and all and the honsty or supposed honesty about thing then you do not think. which I did not I admit I was taken and guess I learned a lesson

[katya]

</span>Katya I agree about everything you have said. But then I am just a fool and di not htink about any of this plus she did contact me out of the blue. I guess when you see a pretty face and you are smitten by the email and all and the honsty or supposed honesty about thing then you do not think. which I did not I admit I was taken and guess I learned a lesson<span =''>
all will be fine. life is continue.

[katya]

</span>Katya, as you said "the world is big enough"


'You lose nothing by it;
You just play the fool
And the lord will, forgive you.
You know it's forbidden
To no one in Russia
To bow and be silent.'

Nekrasov<span =''>
Sorry , but I prefer to read poems of Nekrasov on Russian.
and, if be honest, I wasn't understand this translate, but I know all his poems rather good.
if you want , you can read Ivanov, Gumilev - they are good poets.

[Max]

Basically the poem states that God will forgive Russians for closing their eyes to bad things that happen in Russia. Obviously referring to the past.

Western culture on the other hand believes you should stand up for what you believe in no matter how small or insignificant you think you are and you take the good with the bad as a result.

The poem is meant to make people who turn a blind eye to attrocities feel better about themselves by thinking God will forgive you. Which is wrong. Anyone who believes this poem is right should go hang out with Slobodan Milosovic.

Bad things that happen to good people is NOT okay just because you are powerless to stop it.

Hello Ladies

I am an Australian man that just returned to Australia from Moscow, I was there to marry my Russian wife only 1 month ago. Now I am just waitting for the embassy to sort out her visa before she joins me in Sydney. But I say to all you Russia woman out there, that really you should give the Americans a break, they are note all bad, and I have met many Russian woman that is bad, we get the good and bad all over the world, You should see the Australian Woman, they are not good, that is why I chose to look in Russia, I concider myself to be very lucky to have met and married such a beautiful person as my wife, and I dont mean on the out side, she is as good inside also.

But really I had hard serch for my wife, and never once thought about giving up my serch. So all you Russian woman and American men, keep serching and you will find everthing that you are dreaming of, but dont get your selves in to bad conversations where you find your selves saying nothing but bad things about each other, it is a big world out there and we are all trying very hard to get along with each other, so if either of you get ignored by one or the other, dont take it personaly, just move on.
I wish all of you all the luck and happiness in you serch and future.
Yours Paul .

[clintchino]

alot of posts make sense here,americans are really looking for a nice woman,but,the large amount of scams is really sad,its like every woman that contacts you,3 letteres latter,they are in love with you and can you western union money to them for their visas,alot of american men,only which i can come from,do not trust alot of emails that we recieve from russian woman,we feel their is too many pretitors out their,so this sets us automaticly negative,when i first started writing to russian woman i was very excited,now i feel like,well,when does the begging for money begin,i relize this is not your average woman,but the scammers sure have made it tough,so,anyway,not to sound like a whinning idot,i dont belive you can actually meet a honest woman this way,this is my opinion only,but with all the pretitors,ok,clintchino:(

U all americans!!!What way of life u cowboy freaks?U bunch of hicks, low class shit!I lived in the US long enough to learn about your shallow, materialistic,fake,low,no-value,ignorant,snobbish f*****attitude!It's all about hollywood and the cheap propaganda that poor ladies from the 3rd world countries are chasing you!Earn some decensy u freaks!Go learn a foreign language or 2!Watch some foreign news u hicks!Visit some foreign countries (other than that of your ass kissers)!Only then u'd learn about reality!And won't be really hard before u learn about how blind and delirious u r!U've been all fooled:..what history?what cultures?what values?Go eat your burger, drink your beer, f*** your best friend's wife and then join the Marines to deffend some crap about which you have no idea (u ignorant freaks!!) Only because life is so (Unjustice), we all have to abide by your rules: u Neo-nazis. And since when there was justice anyways? What UN and what Security Council, here comes the US!!!!Canada is your 52nd state..hein!!!u f*****idiot!!!Thanks for your time. And ladies, there are good men all over the world. From countries u can't even think of!!Why do you need to kiss ass for some ignorant, un-mannered, un-cultured, 200 yrs of history white thrash like these??? (Suffer) P.S:my apology to many americans who live in the US and to who these comments do not apply!But unfortunately they're few, they come from different origins (not just based on white ethnicity, or only christian and jewish religion-like the idiot who wrote that). Their problem though is that they've been driven amongst the rest of the cattle, like many others, being smuthered within the cycle of monotonous cheap life:work, bills, taxes and so on! No such a thing like "Joie de vie!" or "Dolce Vita!"..oh sorry american shit..I forgot: u don't speak any foreign languages.And even if you do, you're very good at impersonating!

Hello Katya, I'm Vasilis, I'm Greek. It is my first visit on datingtalk, although, while looking for this wonderful existense( I do not know her name yet), I have visited many times datingfree and frrepersonals. I have been reading your words for about one hour and I try to make your picture( I do not mean your photo picture), your heart and soul.
I believe your picture is amazing. The least I can wish you, to have amazing dreams tonight, every night.
...........I will invite amazing dreams for myself too. Ok, I'm not the right parson to say that I worth amazing dreams. But I will invite them..If they will come, I will come back to you..
Vasilis
PS. EXCUSE IF I DIDN'T CHOSE THE RIGHT TOPIC FOR MY MESSAGE. BUT MY MESSAGE NEEDS THE RIGHT DESTINATION, NOT THE RIGHT TOPIC.

[katya]

</span>Hello Katya, I'm Vasilis, I'm Greek. It is my first visit on datingtalk, although, while looking for this wonderful existense( I do not know her name yet), I have visited many times datingfree and frrepersonals. I have been reading your words for about one hour and I try to make your picture( I do not mean your photo picture), your heart and soul.
I believe your picture is amazing. The least I can wish you, to have amazing dreams tonight, every night.
...........I will invite amazing dreams for myself too. Ok, I'm not the right parson to say that I worth amazing dreams. But I will invite them..If they will come, I will come back to you..
Vasilis
PS. EXCUSE IF I DIDN'T CHOSE THE RIGHT TOPIC FOR MY MESSAGE. BUT MY MESSAGE NEEDS THE RIGHT DESTINATION, NOT THE RIGHT TOPIC.<span =''>
Hi!
It was great pleasure to me, to read your letter http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif your country, as I can see on TV , is one of the most beautiful countries in the word.
and let you see only good dreams http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
good night.
come here once again !
Katya

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Max @ Oct. 13 2002,06:22)]Basically the poem states that God will forgive Russians for closing their eyes to bad things that happen in Russia.

</span>My question too! Reply to an American and you are then ignored. My method? I ignore Americans completely. Possibly most are trophy hunters, collectors of photographs and are husbands. Look to Europe or Australia, places where many friends have successfully met and married and are now enjoying stable, blissful lives full of love and, NOTE, trust.<span =''>
I have the same problem also. Only about 1 in every 15 or 20 women will e-mail me back.
What am I doing wrong?

[Vasilios]

Hello to everyone, since it is warm yet in our country, I invite all for sunbathe, sightseeing, excellent nightlife, traditional and healthy food.

It is for everyone!, Girls, boys, men, women, with children, without children-hey it is time to think about it, children is happiness!-. In the end of the day you may have found your destiny! If don't, then the other side of the ocean is not for you!

It is not a coinsidence the existence of the ocean, think of it!

On the one side, to much money, to much worry for it! Nothing is more important! No time for emotion, share, feelings-except some small breaks, exceptions which confirms the rule-. But all is good, for not to be missunderstood. I'm happy for your happiness. Everyone choose his life, his future. Even a whoole country. It was a dream once! The American dream. And I very much wish, this dream will not become a nightmare. Sincerely!

On the other side-of the ocean- missing emotions, feelings, tenderness, loyalty! Care! Devotion! And beauty, inside and outside!

Could be together? The time can proove, but if the one will change the other,! I hope the beautifull part of the ocean will win. Meanwhile, enjoy some sun, here or anywhere! Think that only the sun exist! Gendlemen, take a dollar to sunbathe with you, it will be the hapiest tan dollar in the world-but with no value, you don't mind!
I forgot! I'm writing from Athens, Greece. My name is Vasilis, I'm 34, I do not have any dollar in my pockets, just one taned in my hands(My swimming dress don't have pockets, hey men!).
PS. I have seen amazing dreams the last days. Thank you very much lovely.

[katya]

</span></span>My question too! Reply to an American and you are then ignored. My method? I ignore Americans completely. Possibly most are trophy hunters, collectors of photographs and are husbands. Look to Europe or Australia, places where many friends have successfully met and married and are now enjoying stable, blissful lives full of love and, NOTE, trust.<span =''>
I have the same problem also. Only about 1 in every 15 or 20 women will e-mail me back.
What am I doing wrong?<span =''>
hi!
write the letter, that you send to a girl, here. and I'll tell you, what is mistaken http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
I promiss

I hope you don't include Canadians in this bantor. Canadians are different from our cousins to the south. I know of many men who married Russian and Ukrainians they could not be happier. I feel for that Steve fellow who lost his wife after some years. You know the guy that gave alist of his equity. God it reminded me of a shareholder meets at GM!!!! Maybe he should have been a better friend and lover to his wife then a provider!!! Anyways, the City of Edmonton Alberta has 30% of it's people speaking Ukrainian or Russian. Wayne Gretzky's grandfather came from Belerus. My point is that we should not be lumped together. People are different everywhere. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif Cheers Byoof.

Hey Katya, I feel for the woman being asked for sex after a few letters. How %$#^%@#degrading. In my case, I am happy if U get a few responses. I think that Russian women and of course, Ukrainian women are beautiful but they seem to have more on the inside. Their beauty is not just skin deep but to the bone. I am still trying to find my love to be!!!!Please don't think that all men are like that. They aren't. I just want to treat a woman decently and we can be happy together. Some men can ruin it for others who deep and decent and looking for more than the quick bang!!! Cheers. Toronto Maple Leaf...RULE!!!!!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,14:48)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,13:52)]Why are so many Americans not serious?

Because there are 250 million Americans.

Funny, all I did was send a single letter to a lady and now I am bombarded with junk emails from addresses that end in .ru. You know, just like several of these. What a shame.

[katya]

</span>Hey Katya, I feel for the woman being asked for sex after a few letters. How %$#^%@#degrading. In my case, I am happy if U get a few responses. I think that Russian women and of course, Ukrainian women are beautiful but they seem to have more on the inside. Their beauty is not just skin deep but to the bone. I am still trying to find my love to be!!!!Please don't think that all men are like that. They aren't. I just want to treat a woman decently and we can be happy together. Some men can ruin it for others who deep and decent and looking for more than the quick bang!!! Cheers. Toronto Maple Leaf...RULE!!!!!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif<span =''>
when you meet human in real life you understanding , that she( or he ) is different , then in real life. may be worse, but may be better http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif but different, then you was think.

[katya]

</span>Funny, all I did was send a single letter to a lady and now I am bombarded with junk emails from addresses that end in .ru. You know, just like several of these. What a shame.<span =''>
and what you don't like ?
men here writing, that they cannot find letter http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif))) and you have a lot of it.
be happy! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif)))
and that adresses, that you thinking superfluous for you - give to that man , which waiting ever one letter http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif)))))))))))))

I have written to many Russian women. I have received ZERO responses! I guess all of the Russian women ignore American men now? This is very depressing. I think there are many beautiful women on the sites I have visited. I only hope that some of them will answer my letters. Perhaps my soul mate is out there, and yours too. Dont let the opportunity pass you by!

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 21 2002,14:32)]I have written to many Russian women.

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 19 2002,12:29)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,14:48)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,13:52)]Why are so many Americans not serious?

Because there are 250 million Americans.

[liam]

Max,
Thanks for the wonderful translation you kindly provided Katya with for the Nabrasov poem !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. Its easier to be critical than correct. Katya's absolutely right in her response and perhaps this russian proverb will offer Max some guidance "There is no shame in not knowing, the shame lies in not finding out"

I would like to ask Katya, or anyone. I have been corresponding to this girl. I really like her, and she likes me! I got an email from her the other day. She loves my poems and letters so much. She was bothered though, she told me that she could not pay for the translation costs. She would have to discontinue the correspondance. She hated to do that. She joined this club so she could write to me. I believe her!!! She asked me,(very reluctantly I might add), that if it would be ok for me to pay her membership. I told her that this is only a "bandade solution". She would have to start learning English. I told her I would do what I could! Anyways, I don't want to lose her, but I don't want to be made a fool, either. Deep down, it seems like a reasonable request. She wants to get to know me better and I want to know her better. I guess I need reassurrance. I truly adore this woman, but I just don't want to get hurt. I may be a big, burly, guy, but I get hurt quite easily. I write her poetry every day, my poetry, and I get great enjoyment out of that. What do you think that I should do? Any feedback would be welcome! Cheers. Byoof. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[jlaner69]

I realize there are some real idiots out there with negative intentions, of both genders. To meet the person you might fall in love with requires that we take risks and sift through a lot of rubbage to find the gem. I truly do not want to see you ladies think badly of all American men (as I am one too) because many of us are very sincere and have pure motives. Personally I have always understood that Russian and most Slavic women are extremely devoted and faithful in nature and tend to place family first, which is certainly not often the case here in the US from many women.

I have never felt like if I meet a lady I am "owed" or deserving of sex or anything else. Personally I talk to them by phone enough to know that we both are equally excited and hopeful that our meeting transpires into a much more permanent situation. There are men here in the US who have good intentions, believe me. You just have to find us versus the lecherous perverts who think every woman should be their sex toy. (This makes it sound as if I am so pious and non-sexual, and that is not true at all...lol...but when the time is right both parties know it).

So please ladies, don't write us all off as a lumped group ok? Judge us on our own merits, as you want us to do for you as well. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

John

[jlaner69]

Byoof,

If this woman gives you such pleasure and joy then I say to go for it. Send the Western Union directly to the translation service. Yes we may get taken once in a while but I'd rather err on the side of trusting than being cynical, especially since from your comments you seem to truly look forward to your correspondence with this young lady. And I agree, tough as we are on the exterior, you are not alone in being vulnerable and hurt when a woman betrays your trust. But forge ahead and try again, I say! Hope that helps man! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

John

Cheers. that was just what I needed. She is very special too me. I cannot give you details, but I think she is on the 'up and up'. Thanks, mate Byoof http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[jlaner69]

My pleasure Byoof! best wishes for you man, I'm pulling for you!

Cheers! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

John

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 22 2002,11:58)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 19 2002,12:29)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,14:48)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 02 2002,13:52)]Why are so many Americans not serious?

Because there are 250 million Americans.

[katya]

</span>I would like to ask Katya, or anyone. I have been corresponding to this girl. I really like her, and she likes me! I got an email from her the other day. She loves my poems and letters so much. She was bothered though, she told me that she could not pay for the translation costs. She would have to discontinue the correspondance. She hated to do that. She joined this club so she could write to me. I believe her!!! She asked me,(very reluctantly I might add), that if it would be ok for me to pay her membership. I told her that this is only a "bandade solution". She would have to start learning English. I told her I would do what I could! Anyways, I don't want to lose her, but I don't want to be made a fool, either. Deep down, it seems like a reasonable request. She wants to get to know me better and I want to know her better. I guess I need reassurrance. I truly adore this woman, but I just don't want to get hurt. I may be a big, burly, guy, but I get hurt quite easily. I write her poetry every day, my poetry, and I get great enjoyment out of that. What do you think that I should do? Any feedback would be welcome! Cheers. Byoof. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif<span =''>
hi, Byoof!
I want to be misteaken now, but , I want to tell you one thing. Not long time ago I was read in newspaper, how 2 19 years old boys was take from foreign people 100000 $ for one month. they was take picts of nice girl in Internet, give it on sites and was writing that tha men was want to hear.
and men was give they money.
this is first, that I want to tell you.
second- there are a lot of translates, which free of pay here, in Internet.
third. Do you have her telephone nomber? was you telling with she? do you have her real adress, to where you can write her real letter, and from here she can answer you ? if no - ask her about it.
.........
and if you belive her too much , I can her translator.
absolutely free of pay. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
if she was telling, that she was give he letter to you for money to translate to another people - she cannot against, that I'll help her free of pay.
...........
and if she will tell , that she haven't phone, adress she will give later, and she need money to studying English - don't belive. and run fast from her.
Let you be happy.
Katya

Thank you Katya. She has not given me a phone number because she said she does not have a phone at home. I know she lives in Lugansk. Now, I know that this might sound a bit supicious (almost dodgey) to you. But she sends me her pictures every day. I know that it would be impossible for someone else to get that many pictures. She is signed up with Datingclub.org. I do believe that charge their clients. Not only that, I had another girl who used to write me before this girl I had met. And her agency had emailed me one day asking for money for translation. The girl, herself did not ask me for money but her agency did. You know, Katya, I really like this girl, but I don't want to get hurt!!! I wish ther would be some way of finding out if she was "stringing me along". I really don't know what to do. Thanks for the email Cheers Byoof http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[katya]

</span>Thank you Katya. She has not given me a phone number because she said she does not have a phone at home. I know she lives in Lugansk. Now, I know that this might sound a bit supicious (almost dodgey) to you. But she sends me her pictures every day. I know that it would be impossible for someone else to get that many pictures. She is signed up with Datingclub.org. I do believe that charge their clients. Not only that, I had another girl who used to write me before this girl I had met. And her agency had emailed me one day asking for money for translation. The girl, herself did not ask me for money but her agency did. You know, Katya, I really like this girl, but I don't want to get hurt!!! I wish ther would be some way of finding out if she was "stringing me along". I really don't know what to do. Thanks for the email Cheers Byoof http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif<span =''>
I am very sorry, but I was early hear from men about girl from Lugansk.
and about thta , that she aren't ask you about money, but it doing agent - if is famoese joke.
I hope, that your girl is real.
but thinking a little.
if you want, I can give you e-mail man , that was have bad experien with Lugansk. May be , you will believe he ?
he aren't from America, he is from England. as I remember http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
But he is clever man , and wasn't give money for they http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif I like he for it http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif)))
and, understand.. if she really want to be with you - she'll be interesting to hear your voice. and it isn't too hard on day ask her girl-friend that you will call to her.
and.. if she have Internet, she cannot haven't telephone.
thinking.
I wish you be studying on mistakes another people .and if she real - big happyness.
P.S. how do you think , men , which was send his money for girl wasn't love they ? and wasn't think , that they are real ?

I understand what you are saying ,Katya. She has no computer of her own, so she has to go to the agency to do everything. I did not help her, yet with respect to the money. I am trying to be pragmatic about this. She did tell me that I could phone her but I would have to do it when she was at the agency. Apparently, she has no English ability. That works for me. I taught ESL all over Asia and the Middle East. I can help her. She loved the idea of us talking together. But I could only do this when her agency was open for business. I hear that it is very expensive to use the interet in Russia and the Ukraine, all over the CIS. I know, you are right, I should be more prudent. But this guy is thinking more with his heart than his head. Taank you for your email. You have helped out, tremndously. Cheers Byoof

Hi, forgive me for being indulgent. Katya, it is byoof again. I got an email from the girls agency. It costs 5 dollars to interpret and 1 dollar for the email. Now he gives a break of 100 dollars for 20 letters, 180 for 40 letters (i.e. translation and internet fees). You get unlimited access for 500 dollars. a month. I pay 500 dollars for a nice bachelor flat. I think that these prices are outrageous!!! I need some advice here. I am not sure of what to do. I care about this woman, but in order to talk to her for a year, I would have to "shell out 6 grand". http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif Cheers Byoof

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 23 2002,22:51)]Hi, forgive me for being indulgent. Katya, it is byoof again. I got an email from the girls agency. It costs 5 dollars to interpret and 1 dollar for the email. Now he gives a break of 100 dollars for 20 letters, 180 for 40 letters (i.e. translation and internet fees). You get unlimited access for 500 dollars. a month. I pay 500 dollars for a nice bachelor flat. I think that these prices are outrageous!!! I need some advice here. I am not sure of what to do. I care about this woman, but

Thank you Katya. I'll take your advice and move on. I don't need problems with this situation. I think that the girl is trustworthy. But you pose and good point about the agency. It is too bad, becuase i really cared for this girl. I don't want to be cynical but it just seems to be a bad situation all the way around. Thank you. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif Byoof

Byoof,

I must agree with Katya on this subject. When I go to other countries in Europe I usually pay about $1.00 for an hour of internet access. Sometimes I don't pay anything because I'm only on the computer for about 10 minutes. I can tell you from years of experience with RW/UW that what is possibly happening is a little disturbing.

Go and check out the agency and girl on some of the scam sites. There are a dozen sites dedicated to exposing scams and the people behind them. Katya is correct about buying a computer in the FSU. For about $500.00 it is possible to buy a decent used computer. My girlfriend Toma had no problems giving me her address and telephone number right from the start. I was lucky though because she is also friends to the girl my friend in Arizona is dating. So, I got a personal introduction without going through a marriage/dating site.

Be aware of anyone asking for money on the internet. I know that it may seem harsh, but if one woman can get 10 guys to send her $20.00 a month then she will be living a pretty decent life.

There are also services where you can have someone investigate her if you feel really uncomfortable. These agencies can do a background check and determine if she is living alone, has a job, her family history, where she lives, etc. all for about $400.00.

I know how easily it can be to fall in love with Russian or Ukrainian women. They are something special. Believe me when I tell you from experience about scams.

One last piece of information. My previous girlfriend used a translator for e-mails and found out after a couple of months that they (the translator) was sending me very descriptive and sexually suggestive letters. I was (had) the wrong impression of Galina because I'd get a letter about having sex with her and another woman at the same time. When I asked Galina about this she was furious and confronted the translator. Seems the translator was taking the liberty of living her fantasy through Galina's mail.

Fun stuff, huh?

Cheers from Holland,

Jon

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,10:11)]Byoof,

I must agree with Katya on this subject.

Byoof,

Here is one which is pretty good starting point. It will also show you some basic tips to avoid scams. There are really about a dozen sites that offer Black Lists of agencies and women who have been known to solicited money from men with no intention of marriage.

http://www.womenrussia.com/blacklist_summary.htm

Also, do a search on Google for "Marriage or Dating" scams and look at the results. It is even possible to visit various listserves and do search for the woman in question. Try doing a net search using her name, "Olga Baronova" or something like that and see what comes back.

Sorry to disappoint you, but there are a few women on the net who make a nice living getting men to send them money for letters and translation services. Why is it necessary when they can go to:

http://translation2.paralink.com/

This site offers English/Russian -- Russian/English translations for free. You can visit the site and write letters in Russian for her, so why would she need to have them translated. Most women now are becoming familiar with Translator software. I had written to a few and they said it was obvious that I was using a software package http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

Good luck and keep dry,

Jon

Hello Byoof and others,

I just want to point out that it is not uncommon for a woman in the FSU to ask or request that you assist with her costs to coorespond. I don't think it's a big deal to send $20 for the cost of using the Internet monthly. Katya has some very good advice about meeting women from the FSU and what to watch out for. There are a whole list of "Red Flags" posted on many anti-scam sites that are well worth reading.

Just an example: If the woman never directly answers your questions and just smooths over them then it's a problem.

You have to ask yourself why is she so vague? Why isn't it possible to get a straight answer out of her?

Afterall, if you ask a potential future wife about her goals in life and she never responds then wonder what is her motives. People who can't or don't answer direct questions almost always have something to hide. A technique police use to obtain information is by direct questioning. When the suspect is vague or doesn't give the expected response the police usually suspect that they are not truthful or have something to hide.

Nothing different here when it comes to FSU or any person you deal with. Ask and it should be told. Don't think about love until you have more knowledge of the person. I would love to be "in love" with my current girlfriend, but I don't even really know her yet. Toma has told me the same thing and that even to think about marriage at this stage would be foolish.

Do you start to see where I have a dialogue with Toma on important issues. We are learning about each other with an idea of possible marriage in the future. There isn't any money exchanged between us because that's not practical. Why would I send money to a complete stranger? Toma never asks me for money and doesn't expect me to support her. She already has a job and enjoys working for her own money.

There are so many life's lessons that we must learn from our mistakes or those of others. Don't give up on FSU women because someone out there is right for you. Just be sensible and use your other head http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif to rationalize the possible relationships.

Good luck and keep in touch,

Jon

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,11:24)]Byoof,

Here is one which is pretty good starting point.

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,12:00)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,11:24)]Byoof,

Here is one which is pretty good starting point.

</span>Why there are so many americans, which isn't seriouse?
Lads, what are you looking for ?<span =''>
Well, I have posted a lot of ads, answered hundreds of ads. Worked as a model; nutin wrong with appearace. Have my own biz x2 and 3 houses and goldcards... Still I would agree to many here. Most russian women on these sites are scammers, and they ruin for the serious ones. I ask; who can be so stupid as to send money? Use your hands and mags instead.. As to all the guys thinking Rus-girls are minor... Look at yourselves, your education, and YOUR President... http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

</span>[QUOTE= (katya @ Oct. 24 2002,16:27)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,12:00)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,11:24)]Byoof,

Here is one which is pretty good starting point.

Oh not the Amur agency!!!

Please check further. I believe this is one for the books. One of the most legit agencies is Anatasia. There is also World-Class and Absolute. However, whenever an agency begins to send you multiple e-mails the be wary -- very wary.

Katya, you are a hero of the Russian people. For you to decide to hope over to the Ukraine and visit this woman says a lot about your character. Why haven't you found what you're looking for yet? I would like to understand how you can become so savy at such a young age?

Take care and be careful,

Jon

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,22:56)]Oh not the Amur agency!!!

Please check further.

</span>[QUOTE= (katya @ Oct. 26 2002,23:58)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Oct. 24 2002,22:56)]Oh not the Amur agency!!!

Please check further.

[olivertwist]

Hello Katya

for something to explain i want to send a picture to you..
Is it possible ?
One picture from Sevastopol/Ukraine when i visit there.
You will be laughing in real..
please accept and send me e-mail please

Can

</span><span =''>
I am not understanding, why all telling about woman and judge , from what country women are better?
Look . ordinary 40-years old man ( who was marry one or two, and was have a lot of woman , as he tell about it himself ) come on this site. What he looking for?
Young , clever, beautiful , good-cooking ( I see this question at every 2 or 3 letter ) girl. And if she wasn

[Canuck]

Hello Katya
You are a dream and an extreme help to us hopeless romantics on this board. I have read all through these postings and I am continually amazed at kind and helpful you continue to be, despite our constant mistakes. Unfortunately you are far too young for someone like myself, but I hope to ultimately find someone as giving and nice as you.

My only complaint is that at times you are too gentle in telling us how stupid we have acted. But I am glad you do.

You strengthen my faith in eastern European women. Thank you again cutie-pie and good luck in your search.
Canuck

[Bprdw]

Good point there. Canuck! I am just new here but it sounds pretty good to me. I guess the people here are pretty helpful in this dating thing, eh?!!! Well, you could say that I am chil when it comes to this sort of thing. Great, I can get advise!! Thanks guys. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif (These picture, dilly things are really cool

Girls, what are you do?!! What it is not enough to you, men, to whom you there are necessary?!! You are necessary by them unless? BY HIM WIFE-RUSSIAN IS PRESTIGIOUS. Well you will leave, well he even marries. And is farther what?
On what you look? On beautiful life, like in cinema?
And who has told, what so will be?
They buy you. Have seen enough Sent-Barbara and think, that you paradise there is direct. And #### did not want?
In one half-year home will want from the foreigner, as he to you each penny will count. DARNIT! WHAT LOVE?!!
It is a pity you, girls. Go to AMERICA , as fools.

[Vicky]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Nov. 13 2002,00:06)]Girls, what

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 22 2002,10:50)]The long of the short is this.

The "lack of seriousness" is not limited to "American men"! I have sent many messages to ladies here, and all I get is 1 reply! I have even sent additional messages, and here is what I get: "Please send your message to me at "victoria@spb.ru".
So my question is: "Why are Russian women not serious?"!

And I am planing on visiting Petersburg & Kiev next June!

Can someone explain why the Russian women are only replying one time!

[Vicky]

Santoro,
that brings us to the question that was asked already somewhere here but wasn't answered, if I'm not mistaken... what were you writing to them? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Nov. 14 2002,02:06)]</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Sep. 22 2002,10:50)]The long of the short is this.

[katya]

</span>The "lack of seriousness" is not limited to "American men"! I have sent many messages to ladies here, and all I get is 1 reply! I have even sent additional messages, and here is what I get: "Please send your message to me at "victoria@spb.ru".
So my question is: "Why are Russian women not serious?"!

And I am planing on visiting Petersburg & Kiev next June!

Can someone explain why the Russian women are only replying one time!<span =''>
real women are serious.
interesting , how many women was you write ?
and , I don't know , how old are you. if you are 50 and wait answer from 18-years girl , I don't think , that you will recieve it.
be happy!

</span>Why there are so many americans, which isn't seriouse?
Lads, what are you looking for ?<span =''>
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif Dear Katya;

This miguel native american thank you for your photo I tried to send you mine but am not sure if you received it i have not heard from you and I accidently lost your e-mail address so that is why you have not heard from me. I see that you are still on the internet and that someone is corresponding with you so good luck hope it goes well for you.It was good to have gotten to exchange messages with a nice person like you.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , Migel!
Welcome on forum and you will see me very often http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
I am glad , that you was come here http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

Hi , everybody!
You know , I was understand , in what is problem . I was se one show ( I wasn

[Jon]

Katya,

Please do not watch "Jerry Springer" or any of that American garbage they call entertainment. Save yourself...run into the night screaming...do not believe everything you see on t.v.

Better yet, read a book!!

Jon

[Serge]

</span><span =''>
OH dear Katya...You poor thing you..You have struck apon one of the very worst things that America has to offer. The saddest part is that the Springer show is real. None of it is scripted. PLease just forget the name and the show. THis type of viewing is meant for an "elite"(cough,hack cough) group in our society.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
as I know , this show is popular ...
true , I am not understand , what is good in it ?
it have very hight rating

[Serge]

</span>[quote=Serge,Dec. 08 2002,00:09]
as I know , this show is popular ...
true , I am not understand , what is good in it ?
it have

[Tom]

</span>[QUOTE= (katya @ Dec. 07 2002,23:31)]Hi , everybody!
You know , I was understand , in what is problem .

[Vicky]

Part explanation to the success of shows like this is that people are very much attracted by negativity. Mass media just support the demand. Here it's just the same - in news there are 10 shocking facts to 1 positive (which is almost always substituted by a1 neutral). Crime, violence, terror dominates. And in so called ordinary life... When people see someone really happy they do not tend to get happy as well, general tendency is envy or indifference (rarely). These shows are popular because it might flatter people that there in the world there are some who are more freaky than they are. We have a show here that reminds a bit of american one, and it's very popular, people enjoy watching others beating friends and spouses, cursing, taking skeletons out of the closets. Subsonscious thought is - well, I'm not THAT bad, and let me see, oh, how funny it is, look, she's beating him! ahaha! let us applaude them! Shocking. But still attractive. Reason? Are we...? - No, we are not that bad http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[Serge]

</span>[QUOTE= (Tom @ Dec. 08 2002,05:57)]</span>[QUOTE= (katya @ Dec. 07 2002,23:31)]Hi , everybody!
You know , I was understand , in what is problem .

[liam]

g'day, yeah man, how about throwing some advice this way too, i can't do anything right http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif liam


wheres my mummy???

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , Tom! I was see this because you was talk about it .
See . your children , who look this show , start to think , that it is normal . And think , that will can shock they ? I am afraid .

[Tom]

</span>Tom
You have a Russian friend with you. If I may ask, do you intend to marry...any advice for the would be Russian romeo?
After all the crap I have been reading in the lists (not this one) I guess I am looking to hear some good news for a change http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/QUOTE]<span =''>
She is only my friend. She is married to another friend of mine.
As for good news and bad news, there is some of both in the story. The good news is that the guy had no problem with scammers that I am aware of. Everything seemed straight forward.
The bad news is that, although the phone/email/letter communications went very well for almost 2 years before she came over; when she finally came over here, they did not get along very well. I think they are fundamentally incompatable in certain respects. And they never learned this until they finally lived together for a short while.
But the good news again is that, although she has been here for almost 3 years, they have not gotton divorced yet. They seem to be trying to make it work. If Sveta just wanted a Green Card, she could have divorced him already. But she hasn't. So she is an honost girl with honest intentions.
Their problems have little to do with the American/Russian compatability, and more to do their personalities.

What I think I have learned from their relationship is that there is a certain amount of risk involved with marrying a 'stranger' (and anyone with whom you have not spent a signifacant amount of 'face time' is a stranger), even if both parties are honest in wanting a marriage that works, and they are not just trying to scam each other.

[Tom]

</span>[quote=Tom,Dec. 08 2002,05:57]
Hi , Tom! I was see this

[Xutesute]

What gets me is why people would want to air their dirty laundry across the nation. Some will do anything to get on TV, it's embarrassing.

That type of show does tend do desensitize people, especially children. Violence begets violence.

I hate to think that people around the world are judging the U.S. by the likes of Jerry Springer.

Craig.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Tom http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
we have this TV near at 5 o clock at day.
my sister ( she is younger , then me ) - I think , that she will see it with pleasure . it is bad , so , I'll not talk her baout this show.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Tom , I was want to ask you .
what was think relations and friends of your friend , when Sveta was only come to America ? How was they concern her ?

[Tom]

</span>[quote=Tom,Dec. 08 2002,05:57]
Tom , I was want to ask you .

[liam]

g'day,

yeah theres definately a dodgy stereotype surrounding the russian bride thing. Although to be honest i've never met one, i've met heaps of philopino/thai/viet brides here in nz, its sometimes seems in the supermarkets that everyother fat old farm boy has one of these often ridiculously pretty girls with them. i think that in-itself is where the stereo type comes from, men in there fifties with very attractive early twenties wives. people naturally assume its only about sex, maybe it is, maybe its not, maybe people are jealous. to the girls though i think 'well done' a lot leave lives of mega-poverty and at least here the government will protect there human rights. maybe having sex once every blue moon when her kiwi husband can afford the viagra is worth it!!! liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Tom , I was means his parents , may be , brothers- sisters ?
In Russia there are a lot of short

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Liam , I know one girl , which was marry on Greece man only because she was dream to go from the Ukraine. She wasn

[liam]

g'day katya, yeah its the same with men, usually they are a little afraid of there mother-in-law too, there are lots of mother-in-law jokes, and often when the mother-in-law comes to visit the man spends a lot of time in the pub (peace and quite) http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif , liam

[Tom]

</span>[quote=Tom,Dec. 13 2002,02:25]
Tom , I was means

[Tom]

</span>[QUOTE= (liam @ Dec. 13 2002,02:45)]g'day,

yeah theres definately a dodgy stereotype surrounding the russian bride thing. Although to be honest i've never met one, i've met heaps of philopino/thai/viet brides here in nz, its sometimes seems in the supermarkets that everyother fat old farm boy has one of these often ridiculously pretty girls with them. i think that in-itself is where the stereo type comes from, men in there fifties with very attractive early twenties wives. people naturally assume its only about sex, maybe it is, maybe its not, maybe people are jealous. to the girls though i think 'well done' a lot leave lives of mega-poverty and at least here the government will protect there human rights. maybe having sex once every blue moon when her kiwi husband can afford the viagra is worth it!!!

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Liam ;)
I know one woman , she will be great mother-in-law - but what to do ? I so don

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Tom .. you mustn

[liam]

g'day katya,

are you talking about me and my mother? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif liam

[liam]

g'day katya,

all people are not good

1. adolf hitler
2. idi amin
3. pol pot
4. osama bin ladin
5. josef stalin
6. sadamm hussian
7. dr mengele
6. myra hindley
7. ira
8. mao tse tung
9. etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc,

liam http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[liam]

ooopsy i forgot

george bush

liam

(absolutley no apology this time tom)

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (liam @ Dec. 14 2002,13:55)]g'day katya,

are you talking about me and my mother? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Tom]

</span>ooopsy i forgot

george bush

liam

(absolutley no apology this time tom)<span =''>
Well,
I have never been a big 'Bush' fan, but it may be too soon to pass judgement just yet. He certainly has not done anything even remotely similar to those other people you mentioned. For instance, I am an unapologetic Clinton hater, but would never put him on such a list. History will judge him accordingly, but luckily the damage he actually did was minimal. Many poloticians are like that. I think the more educated and aware we are of the truth about these kind of people, the less likely we are to find then appealing in any way. But that does not make them all evil like Hitler, etc.
We will just have to see how this Iraq thing plays out.

[Tom]

</span></span>[QUOTE= (Tom @ Dec. 14 2002,01:45)]<span =''>
Tom .. you mustn

[Tom]

</span></span>[QUOTE= (Tom @ Dec. 14 2002,01:45)]<span =''>
Tom .. you mustn

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Tom , I am really not understanding such people . I know some , who will be very happy to marry on diavol , if he will live in another country , like Canada or America .
it is such people .
It is strange for me , and I am not understand .
And more I think , that if man from village will take girls from village , it will not be any problems .
but girl , that was born in Town really will have big problems - and not important , where it will be , in Russia or in America .
I have grandmother in a village and I am with here every summer , Helping her , so , I can do some more , then normal girl from town .
But it will be very hard for me .
it is great - but hard .

[liam]

g'day katya http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , my mums very interested in meeting you, please be at moscow airport to meet her tomorrow http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif , liam

[liam]

g'day tom,
yeah man it was a little harsh having bush along side the likes of hitler and stalin (i'm not aware of any u.s led physical genocide), i've got my own opinions on 'our' leaders but this is'nt that type of forum!!!!!i guess i'm just a little bummed that regardless of were war or terror strikes its always the 'little people' who get maimed or die. you make a good point.. cheers liam

</span>Well ladies. All Americans are not married, and are not trophy hunters, and don't deserve to be ignored. To lump us all together in such a derogatory manner accomplishes nothing. Some of us are quite serious and could sometimes have jusy the same type of negatives to say about the Russian girls if we wanted to. This is not easy, and there are some jerks on both sides of the ocean. Pick your mates and good luck to us all with the search.<span =''>
you are right -)))
Russana.....;-)2oks2@rambler.ru

[r601020]

can only speak for myself and the single guys I know in my city -- there's not enough single women here.

</span></span>[QUOTE= (snosbigger @ Sep. 22 2002,06:20)]Well ladies. All Americans are not married, and are not trophy hunters, and don't deserve to be ignored. To lump us all together in such a derogatory manner accomplishes nothing. Some of us are quite serious and could sometimes have jusy the same type of negatives to say about the Russian girls if we wanted to. This is not easy, and there are some jerks on both sides of the ocean. Pick your mates and good luck to us all with the search.<span =''>
Hi !

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi, James!
Of course ,it will be interesting.
By the way , where you was meet your girl ? Only interesting http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Thank you!
Katya

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<span style='color:red'>Here you can find friends by correspondence, a person to travel together, romantic relations or even a life

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Wow!
We are popular http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif if forum using as way for advertisings, it means , that we are better http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Hello,

This will be my first, and probably only, post on this forum. I somehow found this forum and this thread and got caught up in reading all 16 pages http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif . Some of it was quite good while other posts were as idiotic and politically correct (as well as inaccurate) as I have ever seen on any discussion forum.

I am just a normal person from a small town in Oregon. I have a decent job, good friends and a good heart. I just have not been able to find that one woman with whom it all clicks. A good friend of mine met his wife of three years in Ukraine and they are going to have a baby girl any day now. They are supremely happy, both of them have told me this apart from the other so it must be true. And finally after all these years of my being single and numerous attempts from both of them to get me to seek a partner from the FSU, I have begun my first tenative steps.

Ladies if you want to know why so many American men are looking in your direction, take heart. In numerous discussions with my friend mentioned above and a few others in town who have met their wives this way (amazing for a smallish town to have so many) one common thread exists. We see you as lovely, mature, cultured and loving women. All of the men who I know that have done this I would consider to be intelligent, cultured and sophisticated. We are simply looking for a lady who will love us as we love them, and not judge us on what we can buy for them or how much we make per year. When I picture myself with my future wife I don't see us in a huge home with 3 cars and stables out back (although that would be grand http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif ) I see me with my arm around her lightly caressing the nape of her neck while we wait for the clerk to ring up our groceries, I picture Christmas shopping while I make faces and kiss our new baby and she picks out all the gifts because I'm preoccupied http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif .

There are many men here ladies who have beautiful loving hearts but are at the same time as manly as it gets. The difference is we know when it is appropriate to be "macho" and when it is not. I think it takes alot more intelligence and sophistication than is common in this country for a man to even consider looking eastward for that woman who exisits only in his dreams. For the most part ladies I really believe that you are hearing from some of the best this country has to offer. So, again, take heart. Certainly there are exceptions but I think they are in the minority. This is a tough task to take on and those that are not serious will soon fall out.

Also please keep in mind that, money and economics are different over here and it is very expensive for someone of even above average means to embark on this journey. So consider that if you do meet this wonderful American man whom you decide to honor with your hand in marriage, he most likely saved and scrimped and sacrificed, maybe even worked a second job, simply to find you. I'm not saying you owe him anything, simply understand how much he wanted to find you!

Hope my diction and sentence structure were acceptable http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif . And I hope I will find my angel soon. I will be interested to see your replies.

Merry Christmas all

Kevin from Oregon.

[Vicky]

A lovely post, Kevin from Oregon http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

We too hope you find your angel, and she will never ask that question - oh why there are so many americans who arent serious.

Luck and best wishes

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi, Kevin!
I think, you will find. And for what angel? Angels must live at the sky. Let you will meet nice girl, and you will be very happy.
But not all men thinking as you. I know one man , who was come in Russia 7 times! Every time to new girl. It is hobby.
We are friends and he is talking about girls. You know, sometimes so funny. And , more , he don

I tell you, as an american guy, I have been to Russia 5 times and love it there. There are scams of course. But for serious guys like me who are searching for the right one, its still difficult even when you go there. I have had exposure to friends who have brought women here to the u.s. only to find them as cold as fish once the green card arrived., then they bail out and leave or become another person. Lets face it, I would want to leave Russia too if I were a single woman wanting a better future. So, as Americans, yes I believe there are idiots, game players and trophy hunters who are not serious. But advice for the Russian woman, there are these people all over the world, not just the u.s. so, keep trying and dont ask for money since its a dead giveaway. make sure you give your phone number....and be real yourself. Dont be just a photo and money collector for the Russian mob.
It really hurts the serious russian woman looking for love and a better life....... ps: I am also still looking......
candoo77@aol.com

I tell you, as an american guy, I have been to Russia 5 times and love it there.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi!
You was go to girls 5 times, and wasn

[B][I]hi! yes...its real crazy too many ppl from USA and Europe, and they are not serious.. i dont understand such kind of ppl, why are they here in such site , because here i think mostly look for onyl serious relations... and why so crazy men come here!? thats a question.... but there is only one advice in such case.."ignore them!"

[Barracuda]

Since I am an American man and I am serious about finding a good woman to become my wife then maybe I can answer the question from my point of view. Maybe some American men will agree or dissagree. It does not matter because I am sharing my honest feelings here.

When I write to Russian/CIS ladies I speak of myself including faults. I believe it is better to show an honest interpretation of myself to the ladies I write to. I do have a slight physical disability and will share with the ladies I write to when appropriate which is usually about the third letter. Under suggestions made by others here(Katya and Vicky) and several Russian ladies that are married to friends here, I try to briefly cover the disability with emphisis on my abilities so that they woman does not get the wrong impression of me.

I send my photos when asked too. I am having more current ones made with my dog and house to show my physical condition and that I am telling the truth about myself and what I have. Sending old pictures is not the right thing to do especially if some drastic things have happened since the last photos were taken. I expect the same from the lady.

I speak of my family especially since I am proud of them and hold them in high reguard. They are my family and if the woman I write to becomes my wife then she becomes part of the family too so she should get to know them. Even with their strange behavior sometimes.. ;)

I speak honestly about my interests including hunting, fishing, firearms, and other sometimes contiversal subjects. I would not want to suprise the young woman when she opens the nightstand next to the bed and finds a pistol. She might think I am strange now, in the letter, but fear me if she were to find it after coming here.

I do not make a laundry list of possessions for the world to see it just opens me up to scammers. This I know for a fact because while posting my profile on another site I was recieving emails asking for money after one or two letters from a "girl".

I share my employement status but certainly not my annual income for the same reason as above. I do work a very serious job that could affect the lives of not just 100,000 people but closer to 100+ Million people and businesses.

I am honest about my religious upbringing and current religious participation which is Christian. I am Methodist and do read the bible and go to church on occasion. I expect that sometimes religion can get in the way if the man and woman are of different and battling religions like Jewish and Muslim people are on the middle East.

I also respect the woman's ideas and thoughts on any subject and if I have a different opinion the I speak of it in an honest way and I expect the woman to do the same. We all have hopes and dreams and because we are all here, on the internet, our drive and hopes are to find a man or woman that fits us better than those that are currently in our midst.

I also try very hard to write as if I were speaking to the woman so that when we meet she is already accustom to my arrangements of words. English is very difficult to learn and anything I can do to help I try to do.

I try to be respectful in my tone when writing and talking, and thank you Katya for straightening me out on that subject. ;) Talking of sex and other inaproppriate subjects should not be done unless there is some agreement already made. There is plenty of time for pillow talk after meeting and deciding on the course of the relationship.

I do not send money unless there is something seriously going on between the woman and I and she has passed many tests. I've givven quite a bit of money to the Russian economy already so this is just a personal thing.

I try to respond to letters to me as quickly as possible, but there are occasions that may take longer to answer back so be courtious and email the reasons for the delay before it becomes an issue. This I consider a courtesy and shows my interesr toward the woman is genuine.

I speak often of my hobbies and current events in the house, neighborhood, town, and state I live in. Why you ask? Because I want the woman to already feel like she is a part of my life as a friend no matter what her feelings are toward me at the moment. This way she know of my community and friends before she even meets them.

I also believe that if I do all these things then I do eliminate the scammers due to lack of interest, and those that are not serious about forming relationships will loose interest in listening about what is going on in my life. Those that remain are the ones that are worthy of continued correspondence and have interests in forming a more serious friendships or serious relationships possibly ending in marriage.

Barracuda

[liam]

g'day,

i say again, barracuda's not silly.

liam

ps stylish space ship, nice one !!!!!!!

[scammer_hunter]

It's a little bit curious but nobody writes about golden digger.
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif It's possible that somebody tells me why it is so???

[liam]

goldern digger?, the childrens t.v character from the 70's?, in england? liam http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Anuta, sometimes people have nothing to do . you are right , we must run from they http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif I know , that someone have hobby - to receive picts of girls , as more , as possible. Someone was have bad experience and now they want to make harm to all another women. Such people aren

</span>U all americans!!!What way of life u cowboy freaks?U bunch of hicks, low class shit!I lived in the US long enough to learn about your shallow, materialistic,fake,low,no-value,ignorant,snobbish f*****attitude!It's all about hollywood and the cheap propaganda that poor ladies from the 3rd world countries are chasing you!Earn some decensy u freaks!Go learn a foreign language or 2!Watch some foreign news u hicks!Visit some foreign countries (other than that of your ass kissers)!Only then u'd learn about reality!And won't be really hard before u learn about how blind and delirious u r!U've been all fooled:..what history?what cultures?what values?Go eat your burger, drink your beer, f*** your best friend's wife and then join the Marines to deffend some crap about which you have no idea (u ignorant freaks!!) Only because life is so (Unjustice), we all have to abide by your rules: u Neo-nazis. And since when there was justice anyways? What UN and what Security Council, here comes the US!!!!Canada is your 52nd state..hein!!!u f*****idiot!!!Thanks for your time. And ladies, there are good men all over the world. From countries u can't even think of!!Why do you need to kiss ass for some ignorant, un-mannered, un-cultured, 200 yrs of history white thrash like these??? (Suffer) P.S:my apology to many americans who live in the US and to who these comments do not apply!But unfortunately they're few, they come from different origins (not just based on white ethnicity, or only christian and jewish religion-like the idiot who wrote that). Their problem though is that they've been driven amongst the rest of the cattle, like many others, being smuthered within the cycle of monotonous cheap life:work, bills, taxes and so on! No such a thing like "Joie de vie!" or "Dolce Vita!"..oh sorry american shit..I forgot: u don't speak any foreign languages.And even if you do, you're very good at impersonating!<span =''>
I don't know who "Suffer" is, or where he is from, but it is clear that he is an IDIOT!!!!!! I am an American, I am very proud of my country. With so much anger "Suffer" sounds to be "Suffer"ing from extreme jealousy of the USA. I would suggest to "Suffer" that I need not learn a foriegn lanquage, the world needs to learn ours.

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Jan. 23 2003,07:54)]I don't know who "Suffer" is, or where he is from, but it is clear that he is an IDIOT!!!!!!

[Vicky]

</span>I would suggest to "Suffer" that I need not learn a foriegn lanquage, the world needs to learn ours.<span =''>
That's highly doubtful that the world needs to do anything. It just happened so that English became an international language because of trade. If "An American" doesn't want to learn any other language, who has the right to oblige him doing it. It works the opposite way as well.
Actually I doubt as well that majority of people on Earth envy the US, on the contrary they often do not understand the country, if talking about its relations with the world. I myself will never understand who entitled the US with the role of the global policeman... That might make people living there arrogant without any sound reason. I'd rather say though that people and country are "two big differences", but they do influence each other.

</span></span>I would suggest to "Suffer" that I need not learn a foriegn lanquage, the world needs to learn ours.<span =''>
That's highly doubtful that the world needs to do anything. It just happened so that English became an international language because of trade. If "An American" doesn't want to learn any other language, who has the right to oblige him doing it. It works the opposite way as well.
Actually I doubt as well that majority of people on Earth envy the US, on the contrary they often do not understand the country, if talking about its relations with the world. I myself will never understand who entitled the US with the role of the global policeman... That might make people living there arrogant without any sound reason. I'd rather say though that people and country are "two big differences", but they do influence each other.<span =''>
I have no ill will toward any country, but find it amusing how short a memory some people of the world have. when Europe was on the verge of collapse in both world Wars, most countries were all but to glad to have american troops and technology overseas. After the wars, Us money helped rebuild europe then forgave many of the loans. It has become fashionable to sit around bad criticizing the US. I wonder how many of these countries would be criticizing the USA's global policing if, again their security was threatened.
Again, I have no ill will toward any country or their people, it just gets tiring hearing the USA kicked around.

[Vicky]

</span>[QUOTE= (Guest @ Jan. 23 2003,09:18)]I have no ill will toward any country, but find it amusing how short a memory some people of the world have.

Give me a break dude. Americans were needed for to help with the imminet collapse of the European continent. If I recall, it was the Canadians, British , the Russian and other fighting against tyranny. The Ameriacan only came into the picture when it suited your purposes!! So you are in error my friend. I have been around the world I see your countrymen putting Canadian flags so that they do get razzed the shit out of!!! Give me a break. I have many American mates and we can get along when they come to Canada because we respect each other. The only question we have who's getting the next beer. Or pass the pipe around, dude?! It is this ugly American mentality that has North Korea on the verge of war. I saw you awful approaches to diplomacy' in Seoul. The Korean government catoring to the whims Of the Army. It was not different that the British Colonialism of yesteryear, that you you Americans so vehemently opposed in 1776. Your foreign policy is not needed everywhere. I think that most people are to make decision on their own situation without help you Yanks. I bet you don't even know who the President of Russia is? Do you All American? Try to live as an American in the Middle East with your foreign policies and we'll see how you fare in the end. It is a scary time to be an American abroad. Katya is right, you are no better or different that Hitler or Muzzolini. Siek Hiel!!! Uncle Adolf. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Tom]

</span><span =''>
I'm not going to ramble on and make this a long post, but do you want to know what most Americans I know think about the world's attitude toward us? We really don't care very much. And that is because, no matter what we do, somebody is unhappy with us. If we DON'T get involved in all the geo-political bullchit, then we are 'Isolationists'. If we DO get involved, then we are 'Imperialists'.
And two perfect examples are Bosnia and WWII, which Vicky and All Canadian mentioned.
First Bosnia: We DID NOT want anything to do with that European-created mess. But the West Europeans (particularly Germany, if I recall correctly) INSISTED that we do the job. They said that we were the richest, most powerfull nation, so it was our moral responsibility. The West Europeans insisted that something must be done, but that they could not do it without out our help. They did NOTHING untill we reluctantly got involved, AT THEIR INSISTANCE.

And WWII, another European-created mess: I applaud the British guts and courage in standing up to the Nazis. But we all know what would have happened if America had not gotten involved. And yes, the USA was reluctant to get involved, initially. But this demonstrates many European's hypocrisy. All Canadian criticises us for not getting involved quickly enough, AND IN THE SAME PARAGRAPH criticises us for getting too involved in world affairs!!! And All Canadian is not some crazy guy with a unique opinion. His view seems to be shared by the majority the West European nations!
At least the Eastern Europeans are consistant in insisting that we never get involved in ANYTHING! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
And if I were dictator of the US, that is what I would do. I would pull our troops out of most places (including Korea) and kick the UN out of the US and send it to the EU where it belongs. And when somebody comes begging us for our help (which they constantly do), I'd say "Go see if Germany or France will put THEIR money where THEIR mouth is. And good luck, because you are going to NEED it!!!" http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

And that is why Americans don't seem to care what everybody else thinks. There is a saying that goes "You can't please everybody, so you just got to please yourself."

Well, I rambled anyway. Sorry about that! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Tom

Wow, this all got very silly and unpleasant! I have to say, none of you have represented your nations and opinions particularly well, (apart from maybe Vicky) and all this thread proves is that there are stupid people in every country. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[liam]

g'day,

scotchontherocks, its a bit bizzare, don't you have freedom of speech where you live?, so your not allowed your own opinion in scotland?, i think perhaps your a burmese or north korean immigrant, what you've gotta learn is people are allowed to express there opinions.

anyway i'm gonna reply to this cos its a wee bit topical and scotchontherocks, don't worry, i'm not gonna get tortured or shot for my opinion (if your homesick theres a couple of north korean resturants in Stirling).

sorry tom but i think thats its astoundingly arrogant for america to believe that an attack against them should somehow galvanize the world into a consolidated action. What happening in the uk for 30 years??, bombs in resturants, buses, mcdonalds, supermarkets, many many more dead than in the towers, and what did the american government do? practically labelled the IRA etc as freedom fighters, where did the money come from? tens of millions of dollars each year from usa sympathisers, did they freeze those accounts?? Clinton came over and shook there hands!!!!!!!!!!!!.
America is expecting the whole world to react as if it was the worst act of terrorism, deserving the highest level of reaction. If america is so concerned about saving the innocent from the evil why did'nt it step in between china and tibet or serbia and bosnia?, to say about bosnia that "we did not want anything to do with that europe created mess" is wrong, the whole world stood by and watched the mass-killings of women and children, there were places that for all intense purposes where death camps, right smack in the middle of europe, where forty years before millions of people died to save the world from the nazi's. We should all be embarresed that we allowed it to happen when it would've been, and was proven to be , easy to stop. nothing was really learn't from ww2. at the end of the day i agree with war for the right reasons, fight terror with worse terror but not simply for money, oil, prestege or cos of a percieved easy victory. North Koreas basically threatening the world with nuclear weopons and what happens? everyones starting to look like a limp penis cos we are all (especially america) scared of the 'big red dragon'.

liam
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

I don't think we are necessarily afraid of the big red dragon, it's just that with afganistan, Irag, and now North Korea, we are a bit sensitive to the big bully label we have been getting.

Liam: I am as up for a good debate as anyone and I am not stopping anyone from expressing their opinions, but MY opinion was that this debate had degenerated into a needless and childish rhetorical slanging match and wasn't going anywhere, so I decided to express that opinion.

Besides which, I was only really kidding anyway.

Peace.

[Tom]

</span>[QUOTE= (liam @ Jan. 25 2003,03:39)]sorry tom but i think thats its astoundingly arrogant for america to believe that an attack against them should somehow galvanize the world into a consolidated action. What happening in the uk for 30 years??, bombs in resturants, buses, mcdonalds, supermarkets, many many more dead than in the towers, and what did the american government do? practically labelled the IRA etc as freedom fighters, where did the money come from?

[Vicky]

Tom,

I critisize the US because it got their citizens involved in mass killing of other people and turning to ruins cities and historical monuments. A 12th century Orthodox monastery was crashed during one of the attacks - the US even doesnt have a history that long. Actually my point was that while getting stuck in every affair, having your revenge on terrorists or those who the US think behave badly, you tend to critisize Russia for what it is doing in Chechnya. Not everything that's done there is correct, but - we're not entering anyone else's territory, since Chechnya is traditionally part of Russia, and we're chasing terrorists there as well as you were trying to do in Afghanistan. This Chechnya story looks more like GB - IRA affair, just that the scales are different.

[liam]

g'day tom, sorry mate i'm not critisicing the u.s or you for the horrors of the balkans war's. I'm critical of the whole world who stood back and watched, england should have way way way more guilt over the 'in-action' of the UN than anyone else. We could have easily dealt with it ourselves but did'nt. (theres an excellent bosnian movie called "no mans land" that won an oscar last year, which explores this real well).

But vicky, from what i've seen on the news and on the net there is litttle comparison between the tactics employed by the british army and the russian army, in ireland there was no mass rapes of civilians, populations of villages were not taken out and murdered, towns not reduced to rubble by high explosive shells. The conduct of the fighting (whether legitimate or not) in chechnya is extremely brutal. I don't support either side, but some off the information released by human-rights agencies makes for shocking reading, on both sides 'soldiers' are commiting terrible atrocities. Litttle girls gang-raped, preganant women tortured to death etc etc.
I'm not saying the objectives of the russian government or people are wrong, just that there has to some form of 'honor' in war. The more evil tactics that you use against an enemy, the harsher they will fight back, look what happened to germany and the nazi's, they invaded your country and brought upon the russian people a type of "war" that was evil beyond comprehension and look what happened to them. The russians fought back with amazing zeal, and anger and at a massive cost beat them till germany was nothing but a shell of burnt out buildings and dead people. The people of russia do, and always will deserve massive respect and honor for there achievement during that war. But at what cost to humanity? liam

[Vicky]

liam,

the truth and true history is not what we are shown or what we are told. Being not a naive kid, i'm sure, liam, you understand we are shown and told the things that serve the current policy of our country.

[liam]

true vicky, true http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif but still...............

liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Liam , when on cage with lion is write *donkey * , don

[Vicky]

still, liam http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Today on TV there was a report on assistant to US Secretary of state visit to Russia where he said something like this - if russian close their eyes on what we are doing to Iraq, we are ready to admit chechens you're fighting there are terrorists.

Now this is what i call "politics games" http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

anyway, to make matters of war sound inferior to matters of love, let me put here a nicely done questionnary that i was once e-mailed. Hopefully you all like it (i myself was giggling all the time i was reading it).
I think i will need more than one post space, so the reading should be started from here.

This was allegedly posted very briefly on the McDonnell Douglas Website by an employee there who obviously has a sense of humor. The company, of course, does not have a sense of humor, & made the web department take it
down immediately (for once, the 'IMPORTANT' note at the end is worth a read, too).

Thank you for purchasing a McDonnell Douglas military aircraft. In order to protect your new investment, please take a few moments to fill out the warranty registration card below. Answering the survey questions is not required, but the information will help us to develop new products that
best meet your needs and desires.
1.
[ ] Mr.
[ ] Mrs.
[ ] Ms.
[ ] Miss
[ ] Lt.
[ ] Gen.
[ ] Comrade
[ ] Classified
[ ] Other

First Name: .................................................. ...
Initial: ........
Last Name.............................................. ........
Password: .............................. (max. 8 char)
Code Name: .................................................. ....
Latitude-Longitude-Altitude: ........... ...........

2. Which model of aircraft did you purchase?
[ ] F-14 Tomcat
[ ] F-15 Eagle
[ ] F-16 Falcon
[ ] F-117A Stealth
[ ] Classified


3. Date of purchase (Year/Month/Day): 19....... /......./......

4. Serial
Number:........................................... ....


5. Please indicate where this product was purchased:
[ ] Received as gift / aid package
[ ] Catalogue / showroom
[ ] Independent armsbroker
[ ] Mail order
[ ] Discount store
[ ] Government surplus
[ ] Classified

[Vicky]

continuation http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

6. Please indicate how you became aware of the McDonnell
Douglas product you have just purchased:
[ ] Heard loud noise, looked up
[ ] Store display
[ ] Espionage
[ ] Recommended by friend / relative / ally
[ ] Political lobbying by manufacturer
[ ] Was attacked by one

7. Please indicate the three (3) factors that most influenced your
decision to purchase this McDonnell Douglas product:
[ ] Style / appearance
[ ] Speed / maneuverability
[ ] Price / value
[ ] Comfort / convenience
[ ] Kickback / bribe
[ ] Recommended by salesperson
[ ] McDonnell Douglas reputation
[ ] Advanced Weapons Systems
[ ] Backroom politics
[ ] Negative experience opposing one in combat

8. Please indicate the location(s) where this product will be used:
[ ] North America
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Aircraft carrier
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Europe
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Middle East (not Iraq)
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Africa
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Asia / Far East
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Misc. Third World countries
[ ] Iraq
[ ] Classified
[ ] Iraq

9. Please indicate the products that you currently own or intend to
purchase in the near future:
[ ] Color TV
[ ] VCR
[ ] ICBM
[ ] Killer Satellite
[ ] CD Player
[ ] Air-to-Air Missiles
[ ] Space Shuttle
[ ] Home Computer
[ ] Nuclear Weapon

10. How would you describe yourself, check all that apply:)
[ ] Communist / Socialist
[ ] Terrorist
[ ] Crazed
[ ] Neutral
[ ] Democratic
[ ] Dictatorship
[ ] Corrupt
[ ] Primitive / Tribal

11. How did you pay for your McDonnell Douglas product?
[ ] Deficit spending
[ ] Cash
[ ] Suitcases of cocaine
[ ] Oil revenues
[ ] Personal check
[ ] Credit card
[ ] Ransom money
[ ] Traveler's check

12. Your occupation:
[ ] Homemaker
[ ] Sales / marketing
[ ] Revolutionary
[ ] Clerical
[ ] Mercenary
[ ] Tyrant
[ ] Middle management
[ ] Eccentric billionaire
[ ] Defense Minister / General
[ ] Retired
[ ] Student

13. To help us better understand our customers, please indicate
the interests an activities in which you & your spouse enjoy
participating on a regular basis:
[ ] Golf
[ ] Boating / sailing
[ ] Sabotage
[ ] Running / jogging
[ ] Propaganda / misinformation
[ ] Destabilization / overthrow
[ ] Gardening
[ ] Crafts
[ ] Black market / smuggling
[ ] Collectibles / collections
[ ] Watching sports on TV
[ ] Wines
[ ] Interrogation / torture
[ ] Household pets
[ ] Crushing rebellions
[ ] Espionage / reconnaissance
[ ] Fashion clothing
[ ] Border disputes
[ ] Mutually Assured Destruction

Thank you for taking the time to fill out this questionnaire. Your answers will be used in market studies that will help McDonnell Douglas serve you better in the future - as well as allowing you to receive mailings and special offers from other companies, governments, extremist groups, and mysterious consortia. As a bonus for responding to this survey, you will be registered to win a brand new F-117A in our Desert Thunder Sweepstakes!

Comments or suggestions about our fighter planes? Please write to:

McDONNELL DOUGLAS CORPORATION, Marketing
Department Military, Aerospace Division.

IMPORTANT: This email is intended for the use of the individual
addressee(s) named above & may contain information that is
confidential privileged or unsuitable for overly sensitive persons
with low self-esteem, no sense of humor or irrational religious
beliefs. If you are not the intended recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying of this email is not authorized (either explicitly or implicitly) and constitutes an irritating social faux pas. Unless the word absquatulation has been used in its correct context somewhere other than in this warning, it does not have any legal or grammatical use & may be ignored. No animals were harmed in the transmission of this email, although the kelpie next door is living on borrowed time, let me tell you. Those of you with an overwhelming fear of the unknown will be gratified to learn that there is no hidden message revealed by reading this warning backwards, so just ignore that Alert Notice from Microsoft. However, by pouring a complete circle of salt around yourself and your computer you can ensure that no harm befalls you and your pets. If you have received this email in error, please add some nutmeg and egg whites, whisk, and place in a warm oven for 40 minutes.

[liam]

lol vicky http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif , but still.............., its kinda like the chechnya thing, i'm pretty much certain that here in my world until sept 11 there was'nt any real knowledge that the chechen fighters were linked to islamic extremists, al queda etc etc, (though i'd read quite a lot that they were heavily involved in the transportation of heroin via afgan mujahadeen to chechnya fighters to eastern turkey/northern iraq kurdish PKK to eastern europe mafia to western europe gangsters), then all of a sudden when people started to get upset with osama and his bunch of nutters (definately not the type of people we need in our 'scam-busters' army vicky http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif), the russian media seemed to go into over-drive to ensure the whole world new that chechen fighters had big links to islamic terrorists.

(remember nearly all revolutionaries on earth have at one stage or another been labelled "terrorist", lenin and trotsky in the bolshovick revolution, robespierre in the french revolution et etc etc)

anyway, i guess i don't really know enough about the troubles in russia, to talk intelligently about it http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , so i'll stop now http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif it just depresses me when i see the photo's of grozny and the children living in dire poverty and danger. liam

ps. did you know that one of the americans killed in the moscow theater seige was there with his russian fiance and her child to celebrate there engagement (the little girl died also) who he had met on a internet dating site.?? at the moment there is a special site for donations for the russian lady, its about 700usd so far.

&gt;You're absolutely right. He makes 9 spelling mistakes just in the little fragment that you've quoted, and that's without thinking about the grammar at all (you need a strong stomach to read some of this drivel ... how do men like this seriously expect an educated woman to be interested in them???).&lt;

How about this...right now I'm tying on a laptop in the dark so it's easy to make mistakes when one types. And since it's online, it's really not that important when it spelling either. I'd guess if he was going to send an email to someone, he would spell check it.

And second I want to point out that such things are always relative. Quite often when I was in Russia, I was surprised how little most Russian's really knew about their own history. And I shocked lots of folks when they discovered I played chess. And generally beat their local champs while eating lunch or reading the paper or working. Other than when it comes to chess, I'm not that unusual and know quite a few American men who really do know a lot about the world and even know how to spell well.

And lastly, when it comes to grammer, it's a matter of people living in glass houses as I saw grammer errors in your post as well as the other post. :-) And I see three grammer errors in what I just posted too!

Steve Costa

&gt;Hi Katya... I think that I can explain this to you. America for a long time now has been in a state of moral and spiritual decline and I think that Jerry Springer is the manifestation of this decay just like a cavity is the evidence of decay(rotting) of the teeth. &lt;


I can tell Serge that haven't seen any of the TV shows in Japan or even in Russia. Some of those shows wouldn't make in here for the same reason you make about the US. Most TV in all countries is terrible ..not just here. I know this well as I've been stuck in hotels all around the world at different times and watch it.

Steve Costa

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi Steve Costa!
I want to ask you , what TV program in Russia is bad ? but not American , of course.
And chess. I was want to ask you , who is winner of the world in chess ? ;)
I don

[domenic]

I apologize for the manners of many American men who may have that simple problem of not being able to meet date and love any woman in their own country. Many seek them here and some of these marriages work well, others are a disaster. I have met divorced women here in the US from the Former Soviet Union and they have related stories of the men they met on the net and relocated here to marry. You ony hope to find that happiness we all seek. Sadly some of you ladies had been mis-lead or may have even mis-lead men here. You found a less desirable living condition. Hey guys, these women are leaving home, familiy and friends. It is easy to tell others how honest and open we are. From a chair in our home we can descibe the coming of Christ and many would beleive us. These ladies of intellect and beauty seek the new world as our fore-father's did. They pack a bag and depart on this adventure armed only with hope. My home would be blessed by any of you. My life would be enhanced by the presence of someone who has the courage to venture here and to begin a new life, isn't that the American dream ?
Nic

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Think , are you sure , that any of us will be good for you ?
I know one girl , she will go at any place to any man ( of course, foreign ). Are you sure , that you want such girl ? if you want , I

[katya]

You know , only some days ago I was find interesting information. For last 10 years only at America on visa K1 was go 70 000 girls. ( but they think , that was go 140000 girls , because some was go on another visas ).
A lot of marriage are broken in 2 years.
Interesting story. Woman was working at embassy , was marry on foreign man. As she will know later , she was his 3 wife. 2 before her was Russian too.
After year he was beat unmercifully her before she wasn

[reverai]

&gt;
Hi Steve Costa! I want to ask you , what TV program in Russia is bad? but not American, of course. And chess. I was want to ask you , who is winner of the world in chess ? ;) I don

[liam]

g'day katya,

holy ####, how long have we known each other in the internet world?http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif, you've never offered me 21 year old blondes!!!!!!
i'm deeply offended http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif , or do you think that young (and handsome) liam is'nt good enough even for a desperate woman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Liam http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif I know you long time , and because it I not talk you about blond. You not need in blond , you need in good , understanding , caring , beauty woman , which have head on her shoulders. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi!
You know , I am very interesting on such program . News without clothes

[Vicky]

Katya,

don't waste your time explaining riverai to where stereotyping may lead us http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif He must be an expert in pre-revolutionary russia history if he claims we do not know it. He might be a disguised FIDE champion as well.

And he got me interested in that TV show as well... the one where they take off clothes while reading the news. Pity I never saw it. But this must be because I don't have a TV set at home... (which is equal to the statement that Russians dont know their history as i've got two picture boxes, and Russian secondary education is considered to be one of the best in the world http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif )

[777]

Thanks to internet and this forum foreigners are able to inform the russian ladies here what's going on in their country - that's funny http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif! Perhaps by living at the borderlines the trendmaking capital may be too far apart http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif!

It was not an so important thing, but was reported in German television and newspapers:

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , 777!
Strange. All world know about that show , and only Russia don

[domenic]

Those never offered a blonde should think maybe the offer is to good for them. I appreciate that offer but 21 is way to young for my age and life experiences. Liam is it desperattion as you sayr or that dream. I have spent my life in many places many cultures. I have seen the smiles and the hate from many who shun America and hey I cast no blame. Who are we to dictate to others. Think of life and liberty and yes America is there. But hey you pay for it with effort and work.
I to hear from the women I have met here of the so called "men" who married a woman into slavery. It is a gamble for each of us here. We seek that bride, a lady with courage with honor and most of all with hope. Hope for more than might be attained in her country. Katya your sweet to mention your friend and I thank you. My home is open to that "anyone" but not just anyone. She will be like many of you ladies here. A jewel that shine's, gives me light and happiness.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Vicky. You know , you and I will very-very clever. We will know from they so many things about Russia , that we will run from here very-very fast , and never will come back http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
I AM UNDERSTAND!!! They want , that we will come to they , but only Liam was honest and tell , that want it.
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[liam]

g'day dominic,

when the day arrives when the internet becomes my only source of possibly 'scoring' 21 year old blonds i'm gonna probably shoot myself.
and whats so bad about about desperation and dreaming, if your not either a little of both why are you here http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , they day i stop dreaming of 21 year old blondes is the day i marry katya http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif liam

[stepashka]

hello to all I am new here,..steve virginia beach, 43 , went to kazakhstan marry tartar girl, in zags, 1999, problems, I cancel immagrint visa and return 6 months to get divorce, met kazak girl, engaged, file k-1, return 5months to take her to interview in moscow, we come home, have daughter, for 2 and 1/2 years she refused everything i try to do for her, buy for her, will not participate in marrige like a couple or anything, every 4 to 8 weeks she wants to go home to mama,(we don't even sleep together most of the time, she sleep with child) i keep things going as long as i can talking her out of going home, finally she keeps this up and i can't stand it and tell her fine go home!, all of a sudden ( after tickets bought) now she wants to stay and try! and my docha ( 2.5) is with her,...and when i call oh, i love you , i hope you want us back, i want us to be a family, and so on,...i dont know if this miracle can actually happen, but i'm not so sure i can trust it,....or that anyone will be any happier than they were before she left?? and now i am 43 yo man with 3 divorce( well 2 we have not decided on that yet so are still married even though she is in KZ for over 3 months and no return ticket),.. and not to mention spending 3 years of my life and 30,000$ to find happieness and have what i think is a better girl!! what should i do?? i am stuck in the middle of being cynnical because of my expiriences and my wish to still be happy and have a real family,...make no mistake this is not a bad girl, and she did nothing wrong to me, and i did nothing to her in fact we almost never even fought ( except silently) she was typical asian demeanor, quiet, reserved, so on,...i am also thinking if i do try again ( i am very persistant, and hate to walk away from equity) what would the next russian girl think of this?? i feel a little ashamed, but at least i am honest, i would never hide this or try to decieve another girl, ....i notice that there are a couple of russian girls on this list,..what would you think?? i am really intrested to hear!! i really need some helpful insight with all of this it is a very difficult situation to figure out,....anyone can reply privatly to home email trtlhart@infi.net,..no flamers please

[Tom]

At risk of offending the easily offended http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , I will add something to this discussion.
About knowledge of history; I know my history better than most Americans, which probably means that my knowledge of history is only 'average' compared to most Europeans http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
But I believe it is possibles that some Russians really don't know some aspects of history (even their own) that are common knowledge among 'Westerners'. This is probably due to the old Soviet Union and the fact that they did hide many important aspects of history, and distorted others, from their citizens. I am sure that has not been the case for at least the last 10 or 15 years, but it takes a long time for such past deficits to be overcome.
I can give you some specific examples from my personal experience;
I have mentioned Sveta, a Russian friend of mine. She has been here in the US for about 3 years. SHe is 28, so you can judge for yourself what period in time her education took place. She is a VERY smart girl, and she is well educated (she is a mechanical engineer.) And she is interested WWII. When she first came over, she wanted to rent WWII movies at the Movie Rental. We rented a movie about Prisoner of War camps; the camps that held primarily Americans and Brits, etc. She was so disgusted by the movie, that she refused to whatch it after the first 15 minutes. It was absolutely NOTHING like what she was taught in school. SHe was disgusted by how well Americans and Brits were treated by the Nazis. SHe refused to believe that the camps were any different than the Jewish concentration camps. SHe insisted that it was not accurate, and that the history she learned back home was the only truth and that our history was a lie.
I know that Russians were treated horribly by the Nazis, so that is where her history came from. But she refused to believe that Western Europeans were treated any better. I guess I don't blame her. I must be a horrible thing to learn that your own people were treated so much worse than others.
Another thing she had no knowledge of was the Hitler-Stalin Pact. When I explained it to her, she refused to believe it and insisted that is was a lie.
Actually, she has been shocked about many things that she has learned anout Russia and the world, that she never knew before she moved here (but she did not have regular internet access back home in Sevastapol.).
But I know that these things are changing very rapidly. I am sure both Vicky an Katya know all about the Hitler-Stalin Pact, etc. But I think that it was not very long ago that information was very restricted in the East compared to the West.
I know many Americans are very ignorant about history. I am sure that most Russians probably know Russian history better than Americans know American history. But if Americans don't know their history, it is their own fault. It is not because the government hides it. I know some people will not want to believe it, but it is true. Just for example, one of my college professors was an avowed communist. And this was back when there was still a Soviet Union. And this was not very uncommon. Communism and other extreme 'isms' were actually somewhat popular on college campuses back in the 60's, for example.
Anyway, I rambling and am not sure how to end this post, but I hope you understood what i am trying to say and don't get terribly offended or anythng http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Tom

[liam]

g'day tom,

Hitler-Stalin pact?, now call me a dumb englishman from manchester but i seem to remember from my school-days that germany and russia fought each other in ww2.
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif now you americans (or more affectionality, the 'giant snakes head') are trying to change history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, what'll be next?, man, george orwell was right!!!!!!!!!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif liam

[777]

Many themes and users circle here - very good - http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif noone should be irritated http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/blues.gif me answering to a former posting

[777]

liam @ Jan. 28 2003,19:50

Oooh poor liam! You're seeming to laugh seriously! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/blues.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif
Of course Hitler and Stalin have been allies to subdue Poland,
before Hitler invaded SU surprisingly for Stalin who had ignored all warnings before.
You could have easily found much about it by using an internet search machine.

I see your chances of marrying an intelligent Russian lady rapidly dwindle, must hope 21blonde isn't too demanding in this respect! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Tom]

</span>[QUOTE= (liam @ Jan. 28 2003,19:50)]g'day tom,

Hitler-Stalin pact?, now call me a dumb englishman from manchester but i seem to remember from my school-days that germany and russia fought each other in ww2.
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Tom]

</span> liam @ Jan. 28 2003,19:50

Oooh poor liam! You're seeming to laugh seriously! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/blues.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif
Of course Hitler and Stalin have been allies to subdue Poland,
before Hitler invaded SU surprisingly for Stalin who had ignored all warnings before.
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif<span =''>
Oops!

[katya]

</span>[QUOTE= (stepashka @ Jan. 28 2003,18:14)]hello to all I am new here,..steve virginia beach, 43 , went to kazakhstan marry tartar girl, in zags, 1999, problems, I cancel immagrint visa and return 6 months to get divorce, met kazak girl, engaged, file k-1, return 5months to take her to interview in moscow, we come home, have daughter, for 2 and 1/2 years she refused everything i try to do for her, buy for her, will not participate in marrige like a couple or anything, every 4 to 8 weeks she wants to go home to mama,(we don't even sleep together most of the time, she sleep with child) i keep things going as long as i can talking her out of going home, finally she keeps this up and i can't stand it and tell her fine go home!, all of a sudden ( after tickets bought) now she wants to stay and try! and my docha ( 2.5) is with her,...and when i call oh, i love you , i hope you want us back, i want us to be a family, and so on,...i dont know if this miracle can actually happen, but i'm not so sure i can trust it,....or that anyone will be any happier than they were before she left?? and now i am 43 yo man with 3 divorce( well 2 we have not decided on that yet so are still married even though she is in KZ for over 3 months and no return ticket),.. and not to mention spending 3 years of my life and 30,000$ to find happieness and have what i think is a better girl!! what should i do?? i am stuck in the middle of being cynnical because of my expiriences and my wish to still be

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , 777!
If true , you talk me a lot of news. Such feel , that foreign men too more interesting any erotic in Russia , then Russia http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif ))))
in any country ( except Vatican , I hope ) is some places for men , which are very interesting on such things. Here we call such men * ozabochennie * - in English it will be something like preoccupied , but some another sense. I wasn

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , Tom!
I am clever girl , I know not only history of Russia , but of America too

[Vicky]

Interrupting the history class with reply to another message, sorry http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Steve,

One thing I didn't understand after reading your story - "for 2 and 1/2 years she refused everything i try to do for her". Didn't your marriage last 2,5 years? so she started refusing this everything right from the very beginning? If you don't consider me too curious or minding others business, write why she was refusing, any examples of what she was refusing, and why she wanted to go back home that often.
It's very difficult to judge when there's the opinion of only one side of the conflict, we tend to present things the way they suit us, it's natural that no one will write here telling she/he left me because i treated her badly. Just our version of what happened. Not sure if the quotation fits, but there's a nice saying of some philosopher - "there are only two global delusions in the world: what we think of ourselfves, and what people think of us".
Well, to make it shorter - the information you gave is insufficient to give any judgement of either sides, but as far as you made us informed i wouldn't suggest you should quit this marriage and run for another, give it another try, especially, as Katya noted, because you both have a daughter that you apparently love.

[liam]

g'day all,

well it seems my degree is'nt worth the paper its written on, back home we still believe that chairman mao did the tibetans a big favour by invading, that england still 'rules the waves' and that stalin was a poor misunderstood georgian with an admirable grasp of the concept of human rights. http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif lol

the contrast between the war fought on the eastern front (ussr/nazi germany) as opposed the fighting on the western front (allied/nazi) is massive. Hitler and his merry bunch of psychopaths, always thought of the west, and inparticular the english as 'gentlemen', to be treated accordingly. Yes, there was a certain amount of propaganda aimed at the uk, but it was usually along the lines of poking fun at the british class system etc etc. . Against russia though they demonized the russian people, in the same way they characterised jewish people. They were commonly refered to as 'untermench' (sub-human), they were totally portrayed, as a people without culture or morality. The bestial cruelty of the eastern front never really appeared when the nazi's fought the allied armies, there were very few massacres where-as in russia the sheer scale of terror and cruelty continues to have little no equal. Katya, at the end of the day, nominal treaties with the red cross made absolutley no difference, hitler and stalin both broke treaties willy-nilly, it simply came down to a belief that the russian people were worthless and to be treated as such. Treaties don't save people from mass-murder, after all there were plenty of human rights based legislation that germany was signatory to, but it did'nt stop them gassing 7 million jews and reducing most of 'western russia' to waste. Human morality, decency and conduct during war is'nt limited to what is written in law. It is only limited by the choice of the people fighting, no-one can ever say to me that its right in any shape or form to have a policy of relatively comfortable prison camps, where food and medicine are provided for one side (the allies) and on the other have a definate proven policy of the mass-murder of russian prisoners of war, simply because one side has a treaty with the red-cross and the other does'nt. Evil can never be legislated against.

i believe that the american people were justified in using nuclear weopons on japan (the first anyway, the second was'nt needed and was just plain mean), the japanese were never gonna surrender,and america was being forced into a war at massive cost to its own fighting force taking poxy little islands one by one across the pacific ocean' fighting an enemy that was totally fanatical. An invasion against mainland japan was gonna cost at a conservative estimate half a million american lives. so why bother. yep its very wrong to bomb cities full of civilians, but when you take into account the thousnads of documented and proven cases of hideous cruelty to the british, american and australian prisoners of war (the burma death railway etv etc) i have very little simpathy for them. liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Liam. One mistake.
that time Japanese army was broken. It was show , How strong America is.

[liam]

hi katya http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , america was still gonna have to physically invade mainland japan. the cost to life would have been horrendous, hence the bomb, the war stopped within a few hours. laim

[liam]

g'day katya, 'russia' and 'russia erotic' both interest me!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif why have one without the other http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>
I am not agree with you. war was stopping.
but a lot of people died that time - and die now.

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Liam , if you will be so bad boy , I'll go. 'russia erotic' , 21 y.o. blonds ... model ...
you want too many http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[liam]

lol katya http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , as my dad used to say, 'liam, my favorite and coolest son, if you don't ask, you don't get". http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>
nu-nu , Liam. Good luck with models!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[liam]

hi katya http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif , i'd rather rely on my handsome boy-ish good looks, fantastic personality and brilliant sense of humour than luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif another word of wisdom came from my mother, she said. 'liam, my favorite and coolest son, you've got to love yourself before anyone else can love you' http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif liam

[katya]

</span><span =''>

[liam]

http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif?http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif???, if your trying to tell me that you've fallen truely, deeply and madly in love with me katya i'm sorry but your gonna have to tell me in english http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

liam

[Tom]

</span>[quote=Tom,Jan. 28 2003,18:18]
Hi , Tom!
I am clever girl , I know not only history of Russia , but of America too

[777]

Katya @ Jan. 29 2003,03:29

[777]

Tom @ Jan. 28 2003,20:47

Hi Tom!

Before one adds a reply, one may open the "Dating Talk" forum a second time in a second window (and update this as often as one likes) to see the status quo of the postings.

There is no impact (no loss) to the text written in the first forum window.

[777]

Katya, liam @ Jan. 29 2003)

Hi Katya,

so don't think liam as the jovial, harmless New Zealander!
You see, he erased the desaster of his knowledge of the Hitler-Stalin pact with far better comments to the US-Japanese war to impress the young Russian ladies furthermore with his intellectual skills!

Do you already feel flattened by his repeated speaking about marriage? So you're already approaching his well tinkered marriage trap! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

You surely get a surprise asking him about age, number of divorces, number of missing women etc.! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

So it's high time, Katya, to start your fruit scamming counter attack! Ask liam immediately for a box of kiwis and let him send it to Russia, code "emeralds".

(Because Vicky never thought of liam nicknamed kiwis with this, she's still waiting for the real ones.
But now come on, Vicky, try to scam your first fruit box, too! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif )

Tell you both liam that you "so for a long time do not eat"

[Vicky]

Thanks for advice, 777 http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Indeed I never got those emeralds from liam, i guess he's keeping them for Katya, but that's alright, kiwi's fine too, would love to have a couple of those rare birds running around my apartment consistently reminding me of liam http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Besides, i've already decided to direct my cautious scamming steps in the different direction... http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[liam]

vicky, are you a secret agent? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[777]

liam, of course you know about the different meanings of http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif !

Come on and let yourself being scammed a little bit and send something http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif !

[777]

Vicky @ Jan. 30 2003,06:02

</span> kiwi's fine too, would love to have a couple of those rare birds running around my apartment consistently reminding me of liam
Besides, i've already decided to direct my cautious scamming steps in the different direction... <span =''>

Kiwis are safeguarded there, one shouldn't send them, also they would surely catch colds at SPB! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

But real emeralds and kiwi birds! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[Vicky]

</span>[QUOTE= (777 @ Jan. 30 2003,08:14)] Vicky @ Jan. 30 2003,06:02

[quote]
But real emeralds and kiwi birds! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[777]

Vicky @ Jan. 30 2003,11:15

You told it by yourself, Vicky, and not only plain ones, even tons! http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
</span>[QUOTE= ] Vicky @ Jan. 29 2003,09:12

[Vicky]

777,

about oranges - it was Katya's idea to have them, out of citrus fruit I actually prefer tangerines, but would recommend to try once oranges together with black chocolate - delicious http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

now English. Most probably those who write English in their profiles mean the following - they used to study English either at secondary or high school, which will make about several years of studies of the language maximum twice a week for an hour or so. Taking into consideration that almost always English classes are given by Russian-speaking teachers you can imagine that their qualifications were not the best (do not forget that teachers in Russia are among those who get the lowest income, together with doctors and the militia, what a shame). Most of them never visited any country of the language they teach. Curriculum is usually out of date, being designed decades ago. There are a lot of foreign text books available now but not all of them are applicable to Russian mentality. I mean most of these books start with teaching people set phrases whereas here we are used to first build a solid grammar base. I'm telling this out of my own experience, as I've been a Business English teacher at SPB university for several years. (Though I did travel a lot and studied abroad as well.) Coming back to ladies and their profiles. When most of them write "English" it means it's the only foreign language they tried to learn and can more or less understand - in a simple way of course. They can write a bit, understand a little bit more, but speaking skills are usually near zero level. Again out of my experience - I studied English at school, and that was called "the school with advanced learning of English" which meant we had classes for 8 out of 10 years. I could not speak after I graduated. More - in the 4th year of my studies at the university when we had our first native-speaker as a teacher, I once came up to the guy with a simple question and in the aftermath I realised I had made 4 mistakes in one sentence.
There are exceptions to this rule of course, especially among younger ladies since lots of foreigners come to Russia and they can freely communicate (which you might probably know we were forbidden for a long time, we were even not let into hotels where foreigners lived even if the purpose of this visit was a simple cup of coffee somewhere there).
I'm not sure if I answered to your question, but we can never know the real level of knowledge until we talk or write. A general situation is described above and in separate cases you will have to check it yourself. Besides do not forget that there are lots of machine translating programs available right now, and most of them are English-Russian-English, so a lady can use whatever knowledge she has plus the translating machine. If she never learned English this won't help, like I will never use Chinese-Russian stuff http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif And if she has some base of the language, especially a grammar base, it will be simpler for her to master a spoken language - you will help her http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[777]

Vicky @ Jan. 30 2003,16:06

Thank you very much for your very detailed answer, Vicky! (I'm sure, also the members and guests of the forum will appreciate you explaining so much concerning this matter.)

Unfortunately I can offer you only 5 virtuell tangerines http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif, but I'll bear in mind!

[Tom]

All this talk of citrus, should I mention that I am from Florida?

I've been communicating with a Russian lass for a couple of months now. She claimed English as a foreign language in her ad but, as Vicki said, she had based her claim on the small amount of English she learned at school and in truth she was barely able to communicate at all, either in writing or on the telephone. I admit there were times when I thought "what's the point?" and nearly gave up trying, not because I was impatient or anything, just because I doubted we could ever get to know each other in any meaningful way when our dialogue was so limited.

However, I decided to persevere, and I strongly insisted that she make an effort to learn English, but only on the understanding that I would make as much effort to learn Russian. You would not believe what a difference that made. In the space of a couple of weeks we went from banal platitudes about the weather and "what we had done today", to proper conversations about life, politics, current affairs, and err....more personal stuff http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Obviously there are still plenty of missunderstandings and moments when communication breaks down, and it was a real slog to begin with (I even resorted to intentionaly using the same bad grammer she used just so she would be better able to understand me http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif ), but we can now talk well enough to enjoy each other's sense of humour and personality, have a laugh, disagree, share a private joke. We can get to know one another, basically.

I noticed the improvement in her English more than my Russian, but I suprised myself at work this week when I had to call a satelite office in Moscow and I was able to carry out the whole (admittedly pretty basic) conversation without resorting to "vi gavareetye pa angleesky?". It surprised me because I have been trying to learn Russian on-and-off for a few years now (way before I ever condidered looking for a Russian missus) without really getting anywhere. It's amazing what a bit of incentive can do http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi Tom!
If you will have fig

[Tom]

</span>[QUOTE= (katya @ Jan. 28 2003,02:37)]And , if you think , that computer was win , you have

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , Tom!
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
read yourself - Kasparov won the first game last Sunday and Tuesday's second game was drawn.
even if American newspaper.
and one from 3 computer was win.
and more.
Why with computer was play Russian man , and not American , if American people so good in chess ? http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[Tom]

</span></span>[QUOTE= (Tom @ Jan. 31 2003,17:26)]<span =''>
Hi , Tom!
http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
read yourself - Kasparov won the first game last Sunday and Tuesday's second game was drawn.
even if American newspaper.
and one from 3 computer was win.
and

[katya]

hi. I am pity , that shatl was perish, and people on it. I am really pity.

[domenic]

I have only been here three times. wow!!! some of you folks must really be fun to live with. bash this bash that. even think an IBM computer is a chess champ. no one likes us Americans, so sad. offended by so much and have so many opinions. general discussion or general gripe. to all of you who lost your smile heres one from me to you. :0)
to those of you who find fault with everyone else and think your the answer to all our problems I say thanks. to all of you for telling me that I am worthless I say I am so sorry. to any of you who feel superior to the rest of us. I bow my head and pray you forgive us. for being simple useless worthless inhabitants of planet earth.
now for something all together different.
Russia my enemies for so long. you armed the north in a war in asia I was there. I was in europe when our leaders divided us and made us fear each other. I was there when hiltler killed 25 million russians, the purges of stallin, the hunger, the wall came down. east and west joined. afghanistan our CIA armed them to kill your young men.
when will we ever learn.
this internet helps doesn't it. we talk we argue but hey it's the start. hate color, hate nationality, hate creed, but I have no time for that. I dislike close minds as I am sure many of you don't. I remember leaders who really spoke well of what this world could be and they were murdered by the haters.
ask not what your world can do for you, ask what you can do for the world. a deviation but hey we can change the world. even if only for one woman from there to here. if it is her desire to be here. I like the words Katya used. find love and all else falls in place. if you lost money here hey you dumb ass send me some to. so some of us got ripped off, many of us are real open and honest about not only finding a mate but about life and who we really are.

[Jon]

</span>[snip]...all that stuff.<span =''>
Wow,

Couldn't follow that train of thought...what's your point? Try and be a little concise and maybe someone will understand what you're trying to say.

Jon

[katya]

</span><span =''>
Hi , Domenic!
Sometimes we are joking http://datingtalk.info/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif really , a lot of years we wasn